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Subject: Moral Support for upside homeowners
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spl002User is Offline

Posts:28


05/27/2008 1:11 AM Alert 

I am wondering if anyone else is as upside down on their house as us.  We bought our home for $300k at the height of the bubble thinking if we didn't we would get priced out.  We were new to AZ.  We did the right thing and put money down and can afford the payments.  However, it is EXTREMELY depressing that now our house is only worth around 160k and our mortgage is 265k.  So basically we are over 105k upside down, not to mention the money we put down.  I know the value because the house a block over, exactly the same model and actually a little nicer is listing for 160k.  So ours is probably worth less.

Is anyone else in a situation like this? Since we can make the payments we are staying.  We absolutely love Maricopa. However, it was depressing to go look at some of the new model homes and see 4000 sq foot  mansions being sold for less than what we paid for our house half the size 2 years ago.

Anyone else in our situation?  I can't stop dwelling on what if we had waited and going crazy thinking about this non stop.  It would be nice if I knew we are not alone and are not the only ones planning to ride this out?  Some relatives are beginning to make us feel stupid for not walking away.

 


Maricopa is Home!
LeonPotterUser is Offline

Posts:606

05/27/2008 7:11 AM Alert 
Please don't feel bad. You are not alone. I'm not in the situation myself, but I have seen, heard read many people speak of being in the same situation as you are. What's done is done. I understand it doesn't feel great, but there isn't anything you can do to go back in time.

Just consider looking as your home purchase in a different perspective. You were willing to pay 300k for it. Okay, it's done. Now do your best to pay it off as quick as you can. This will save you in overall cost. The value could go down to zero, but you won't owe anyone and no one can hold a debt over your head if it isn't there.

I wouldn't listen to friends and family either. They aren't walking in your shoes. Besides, how many of them WANTED to buy when you bought. So they would have done the same thing if given the opportunity. It's easy to be a Monday morning Quarterback.

I'm here to raise my family. I'm here to participate in the community. I'm here to enjoy my life as long as that happens to be. I hope my children plan on living here when they want to move on their own. We tell our kids that this home we have is theirs no matter what. I consider it money well spent.

My answer WAS "NO" to Q#5 and Q#1.
Proverbs 22:7
The rich ruleth over the poor and the borrower is servant to the lender.
VikingsFanUser is Offline

Posts:36

05/27/2008 8:58 AM Alert 
Oh, you are NOT alone. We are upside down by $100,000 as well. We sold our house in the valley, rolled over the profit into our new house and put down 20% - just like we were supposed to. All of that money is now long gone. I would be happy to ride it out, but we may need to move out of state for a job transfer, and I have no idea how we could do it. At this point, if we sold the house, we would owe $50,000 on a house we no longer own. So, now we have no choice other than to stay here. Which wouldn't be so bad except the outrageous electric bills, water bills, gas and food prices.

I am trying to focus on the positive - we have a beautiful house and a healthy family. Everything will work out in the end. Just count your many blessings.
BionicbunnyUser is Offline

Posts:610


05/27/2008 3:28 PM Alert 
People all over the country are feeling the same way, it wasn't just Maricopa that saw a housing boom. You could consider yourself lucky in that the greater Phoenix area has been growing for well over a decade and isn't about to stop forever. People want to move here for so many reasons. The weather, jobs, low taxes, etc and none of these things have changed. This is a setback for sure but in the long run you are far better off than people in parts of the US. The NE for example, according to statistics they are losing in population and have been for at least the last few years. You may not be able to break even tomorrow or next month but once things start to stablize (if the city works it right) I think you'll see it grow again.
Smokin AceUser is Offline

Posts:246


05/29/2008 4:07 PM Alert 
Judging by the time of your post this is keeping you up at night. Do all you can to stay positive. The market will come back it is just going to take time. No one can say how long that is either. I don’t care if you have been a realtor for 50 yrs there is just too much going on in this country for anyone to tell. As for the family aspect I agree with everyone. No one in this world was in your shoes but you. You have to make the most educated guess at the time on these things. No one has a crystal ball to see where things will go so you did what you felt was best at the time for you and your family. Be proud of the fact that you can afford your home and are not one of the hundreds of thousands in foreclosure. Enjoy your house and make it a home. :-)

Power tends to corrupt and absolute power corrupts absolutely. ~Lord Acton
PhantomUser is Offline

Posts:36


05/29/2008 6:05 PM Alert 

Hang in there. There are a lot of people in the upside-down mode right now. That house down the road selling for $160,000 is probably what they are asking on a "Short-Sell" and probably would not be accepted by the lender.

 

As someone else has said, your home was worth $300k TO YOU when you bought it and it should still be . Things will come back


=-If You Always do what You've always done -=
=-You'll always be what You've always been-=
RichTigUser is Offline

Posts:0

05/30/2008 6:19 AM Alert 

The family who purchased the model home from Hacienda paid 410k.   A similiar home is on a short-sell for 210k.

 

See, yours isn't so bad.

BrookechristinaUser is Offline

Posts:13

05/30/2008 12:34 PM Alert 
We bought our 1918sq ft home for $285,000 we owe $242,000. Same house across the street listed for $165,000.

My husband has been offered a wonderful job on I-17 and the 101. We are so torn - this opportunity could affect the rest of our life, but that drive is terrible and who knows when we'll be able to move.

BB
gizmoUser is Offline

Posts:174

05/30/2008 9:45 PM Alert 

Many folks are very upsidedown on their homes. The question that you have to ask yourself is this.. Is it worth it  to wait this out and wait for a market correction? This could take 8 years or who knows how long before many homeowners are not upside down. The alternative is to walk away. The only downside is that your credit will be hosed for a few months until you fix it. A corporation would have no trouble cutting their losses and moving on when they make a bad business decision. The banks are riding on the fact that families won't do that because of some underlying stigma of not being a good corporate citizen or morally correct.  If the company you work for could outsource your job to India or some other country where labor rates are cheaper, they would do it in a New York minute! It has nothing to do with how much they like you or anything else, they would do it because it would be a good business decision. Should we do any less? Its only business folks, sometimes you make a mistake. Sometimes we just have to cut our losses and move on. That's just my opinion. Everybody has one. In case you are wondering, I have checked with 2 different attorneys and 2 CPA's on the legality of walking  as well as tax implications and both have said it would be stupid not to just walk. Its a business decision, nothing personal.

LeonPotterUser is Offline

Posts:606

05/31/2008 9:00 AM Alert 
Sure one could just walk. It may seem to be the way to go financially. I do agree with the idea it's better to "cut one's losses". However, I believe there is more to it than that. For example, I look at purchasing my home as an expense from the beginning. So I was planning on that money being gone.

You are right in regards to lenders "banking" on one's feeling of morality to pay. I follow this myself. I believe if I was lent money, it is my obligation to repay or atleast do the best I could to repay. I had gone through financially challenging times and I was able to negotiate in good faith. I didn't file bankruptcy.

I understand my situation was different. But,I still stand by this belief. You're right, there may be a flaw with this. But, if home prices appreciated, I wouldn't expect anyone to "walk away".

I don't believe it has to be a financial decision over a moral one or visa versa. I believe there is always a solution. Sometimes, the situation will lead one to the decision anyway. That is a part of life.

All that is happening is a part of life. Our feelings are how we perceive events to be. It's okay to feel down about the situation. Feelings are what they are. The important things is to stand back from our feelings and become an observer of the events themselves. Given all the variables, make the decision one can live with.

BTW, I believe it would take more than a "few months" for any credit to be "fixed" after one walked away from a loan. I didn't walk away from my loan, but I'm still affected by things I resolved over 3 years ago. I'm not one to pin all life's decisions on a credit score. But, I just wanted to clarify what could happen if one simply "walks away".

The ironic thing about people making the decision to walk away, home values would continue to fall. It would spiral down until people decide it isn't painful anymore to stay or buy. Human nature is a curious thing.For the record, CPA's and Attorney's are human beings,too.

Full Disclosure: I'm sure my home is less than what the original purchase price (245k), I'm positive we owe less than the "FMV"(whatever that happens to be). All I'm concerned about is we owe 136k.


My answer WAS "NO" to Q#5 and Q#1.
Proverbs 22:7
The rich ruleth over the poor and the borrower is servant to the lender.
gizmoUser is Offline

Posts:174

06/01/2008 3:11 AM Alert 

LeonPotter, you are a very wise man. Enjoyed reading your thoughts. Take care

OBG IIUser is Offline

Posts:612


06/01/2008 8:00 AM Alert 

credit activity stays on your credit report for 7 years.  Backruptcy for 10.

If you walk the bank has a right to pursue you for the deflault.

 result is you no longer have a house and now have bad credit.

 

As far as fixing the credit report in a few months, I would like the formulae for that!  Could make millions.


What me worry?


gizmoUser is Offline

Posts:174

06/01/2008 2:43 PM Alert 

You can have either a BK or a foreclosure removed in 3 months. I know this is true. There have been NO cases of a bank going after someone in AZ for walking. It would be bad law and wouldn't hold water. Do the research. I have for the past 2 months by the best attorneys in the state.

gizmoUser is Offline

Posts:174

06/01/2008 4:49 PM Alert 

Just to follow up on my last post. There may be extenuating circumstances that would make the bank come after someone but it would be extremely rare. Perhaps if you had a gazillion dollars somewhere and the bank knew of your worth but for them to persue this avenue against someone walking away from their home would be a very rare case indeed.

OBG IIUser is Offline

Posts:612


06/01/2008 7:38 PM Alert 

Sorry, I had an inlaw, here in AZ, walked away from his SUV, only owing 9000.

Not only did they go after him for the entire balance owed, but went after his wife, who was not on the loan.

AZ is community property state so wife can be held liable for husbands debts.  Ever hear of garnishment?  Yes, they can garn. both hus and wife once they get a judgement.

Publishing?  They put the notice in the San Manuel paper.  Who reads that.??


What me worry?


OBG IIUser is Offline

Posts:612


06/01/2008 7:42 PM Alert 

they will go after you because of possiblity of being able to garnish up to 25% of your wages.

If they went after that family for 9000, why would they not pursue a greater amount through the courts?

You are def. getting some bad legal advice.

Still would like to know how to get bad debt expunged from your record in 3 months.  If that is the case, what is the point of bad credit reporting to the 3 CBR's?  Just does not make sense.


What me worry?


OBG IIUser is Offline

Posts:612


06/01/2008 8:16 PM Alert 

Something else does not make sense...

 

Perhaps if you had a gazillion dollars somewhere

If you did, why not just pay the mortgage and not walk away?  If you had a gazillion you could make the payments.


What me worry?


PKMetUser is Offline

Posts:249

06/01/2008 8:41 PM Alert 
Does anyone have any more info. on whether lenders actually go after people who foreclose on homes in AZ? Can they garnish wages, etc...?

They are who we thought they were!
jettasmomUser is Offline

Posts:203


06/01/2008 9:02 PM Alert 
I work in N. phx too and I dont think the drive is that bad. I would much rather be a home owner and not paying off someone else mortgage. Im excited about owning a home. I made sure I didnt buy above my means. I stuck to what I could afford and still have more then enough money to live off of.
Make good decisions for youself. You should always think everything through before signing your life away.
The market will come back, it always does. Have faith!
LoriRUser is Offline

Posts:38

06/02/2008 6:16 AM Alert 
It is a devastating time for the market, but I too like to think of my house more as my home and not just an investment financially. It's an opportunity for my family to live in a beautiful place. It's an opportunity to see a town grow and help be a part of it. It's an opportunity for my children to be able to live in one place for a long time and build memories that will last a lifetime here.

The market will come back. Time after time, it comes back. It's a cycle. No one really knows when, but AZ is a great place to live and people are still moving here. If everyone just "walks away" looking for the next best thing, than it will take longer than neccessary for prices to creep back up. I think now is a good time for us all to take some pride in our homes. Make the best of it. Stand by your decisions. Be honorable and pay your debts!

For people who have extenuating circumstances, then it is completely understandable to think about short sales or even forclosure. It is not an easy choice to make, and I don't think it's right to judge people all the same. If you need to move, than you need to move. Some people though, just want to walk away and try to get into a bigger, better, cheaper house somewhere else and don't think of the repercussions of what they are doing by walking away.
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