Posted By Jason on 02/07/2008 2:51 PM

Posted By 8DaysDazed on 02/06/2008 10:18 AM

Posted By Jason on 02/06/2008 10:02 AM

Posted By 8DaysDazed on 02/06/2008 9:04 AM

Posted By hastings1066 on 02/05/2008 10:25 PM

Posted By 8DaysDazed on 02/05/2008 8:11 PM
it's always been here in one form or another. It has to have been, because there is no way god would break one of the laws of physics that he created (according to ID) and made it from nothing. It would be kind of hypocritical for him to break his own laws wouldn't it?

So, if matter has always been and can't be explaned, is that not as big a mystery as the existence of God?

NO, it's not, not even close. The physical world and physical universe can seen, measured, and tested. The existence of god cannot.

And the measurements say that the physical universe cannot have existed forever. People say religious people are illogical...
Why is it hard to accept that there exists something that you haven't measured yet, so you don't know what rules it is bound to, yet so easy to accept that the universe has always existed, breaking one of its fundamental rules? Makes no sense.

How is having an eternal universe breaking a fundamental rule?

The Second Law of Thermodynamics.

How?  In what way?  Funny how you believe in the 2nd law of thermodynamics, but not the laws of conservation. 

Saying God created everything breaks a whole lot more rules/laws of physics than anything immaginable.

Something that operates outside the box should be able to set and change the rules of the box, no? The universe itself, with no intelligence cannot spontaneously change the laws it operates under right? 

Again, a very convenient answer providing no substance or critical thinking at all. 

Yes our current universe is only 13.6B years old, but that doesn't mean there wasn't one before that, or that after all the stars burn out in 30B years or so it all won't start again.

There's no evidence to show that any of your claims will or have happened. So why is it more believable that the universe changes its laws as it pleases (even though there it has no intelligence) than there existing something with intelligence that has the blueprints and controls to change the laws?

There is evidence of the this Universe being 13.6B years old.  The past and future universes are just ideas I have that can't be proven.  Sound familiar?  

Sampling controls??  What kind of controls can there be or are you just trying to sound scientific?

What, did you think that they talked to every single person? No, they took a sample of the population. Now the questions are:

A) Who did they talk to? This is the sampling population.

B) What are the controls on the sampling? These rules define how the sampling is conducted and results are compiled.

C) What ages are invovled? This goes back to the sampling population. If you sample only old people in the south and only young adults in the west, you'll definitely skew the results (because higher education wasn't as available to are oldest members of society).

And finally you forgot the most important point: Corellation != Causation. If all this sounds scientific, it should. Because it is.

Game. Set. Match.

Brainwashing can happen at both universities and churches. I don't think Ken was talking in absolutes.