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| | Author | Messages | |
Nothingtodo
Posts:283
 | | 07/19/2007 10:53 PM |
 Alert | Posted By EEE on 07/19/2007 11:04 AM
Worshiping what is created, rather than the Creator.
..they exchanged the truth about God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator...(Rom 1:25)
I love how the Bible addresses Man's foolish attempt to replace him and we see how it's relevant even today. There is truly nothing new under then sun.
I love the concept of gratitude when it comes to the natural world and all of it's wonders. I love the idea of showing awareness, however that may manifest itself, of how fortunate we are for what we have all around us.
It seems to me that you're putting a spin on it, a way to make people look stupid for showing awe at what we've been gifted with being able to experience in our every day lives. You take this bible verse and use it as a weapon, proof that those who don't follow it's teachings are foolish and proof that you aren't foolish, and that just seems very high and mighty to me.
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I loathe people who keep dogs. They are cowards who haven’t got the guts to bite people themselves. ~Sir Geoffrey Streatfield | |
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| | Jason
Posts:3378
| | 07/20/2007 1:01 AM |
Alert | You have a computer. Wouldn't it be insulting to the designers to simply have awe for the fact that it exists and not the extremely difficult work that went into it?
EEE's message wasn't intended to use the Bible as a sword, but to point out its prophetic accuracy. | |
Joined: Jul 2005 | |
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| | Nothingtodo
Posts:283
| | 07/20/2007 8:15 AM |
Alert | | Does the maker of my computer really need my admiration? Doesn't that say something pretty immature about a God that would need admiration? Wasn't it enough to just create? | |
I loathe people who keep dogs. They are cowards who haven’t got the guts to bite people themselves. ~Sir Geoffrey Streatfield | |
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| | EEE
Posts:374
| | 07/20/2007 8:28 AM |
Alert | Posted By Nothingtodo on 07/20/2007 8:15 AM
Does the maker of my computer really need my admiration? Doesn't that say something pretty immature about a God that would need admiration? Wasn't it enough to just create?
Absolutely it says something about God.
Exo 34:14 For thou shalt worship no other god: for the LORD, whose name is Jealous, is a jealous God:
He demands worship and he will get it from everybody one day if they like it or not.
Php 2:10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth; | |
Yeah, it's true- He allowed the fall of man/
But He used it now to exalt the Lamb/
The Lord, who's wise, permits existence of sin/
to be glorified in His forgiveness to men/ | |
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| | Sinbad
Posts:3036
| | 07/20/2007 8:32 AM |
Alert | | It's a world without Faith!! | |
Just doing it one day at a time. Change is good and it should be looked upon as an improvment! not a problem.
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San Diego Super Chargers! GO!!!
Joined old forum March 2006
Post count: 3068 + these | |
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| | Nothingtodo
Posts:283
| | 07/20/2007 8:46 AM |
Alert | Posted By EEE on 07/20/2007 8:28 AM
Absolutely it says something about God.
Exo 34:14 For thou shalt worship no other god: for the LORD, whose name is Jealous, is a jealous God:
He demands worship and he will get it from everybody one day if they like it or not.
Php 2:10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;
I don't know, EEE, it sounds awfully immature to me. Jealous? Isn't that such a petty human trait? Does He really sink to that level? I'll worship Him or he'll get me?
It just doesn't ring true to me or sound right, in just my opinion. I don't like the sound of it, it doesn't feel good to HAVE to do something or else. | |
I loathe people who keep dogs. They are cowards who haven’t got the guts to bite people themselves. ~Sir Geoffrey Streatfield | |
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|  | EEE
Posts:374
| | 07/20/2007 9:14 AM |
Alert | Posted By Nothingtodo on 07/20/2007 8:46 AM Posted By EEE on 07/20/2007 8:28 AM
Absolutely it says something about God.
Exo 34:14 For thou shalt worship no other god: for the LORD, whose name is Jealous, is a jealous God:
He demands worship and he will get it from everybody one day if they like it or not.
Php 2:10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth; I don't know, EEE, it sounds awfully immature to me. Jealous? Isn't that such a petty human trait? Does He really sink to that level? I'll worship Him or he'll get me? It just doesn't ring true to me or sound right, in just my opinion. I don't like the sound of it, it doesn't feel good to HAVE to do something or else.
I understand why you would say that. The Hebrew word for Jealous to describe God is different than a Hebrew word to describe the Jealous envious person in the bible. It makes more sense as you learn how the bible describes God and what he wants.
Bottom line, all roads don't lead to heaven.
For example, people are seen here to have a zeal for God, but through their ignorance worshiped God how they thought he should be worshiped(They thought by being a good person and following the Ten commandments were the way to heaven, but they were terribly wrong), so Paul was concerned and prayed that they may be saved:
Romans 10:1-4
Brothers, my heart’s desire and prayer to God for them is that they may be saved. I bear them witness that they have a zeal for God, but not according to knowledge. For, being ignorant of the righteousness that comes from God, and seeking to establish their own, they did not submit to God’s righteousness. For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.
Last Bolded statement highlights how to get to heaven. Believe in Christ. Not trying to be a good person and Christ. Just believe in Christ alone. If anybody tries to add to it, that is a slap in the face to a God who gives grace. | |
Yeah, it's true- He allowed the fall of man/
But He used it now to exalt the Lamb/
The Lord, who's wise, permits existence of sin/
to be glorified in His forgiveness to men/ | |
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| | Nothingtodo
Posts:283
| | 07/20/2007 12:32 PM |
Alert | Thanks for the clarification, EEE.
Just a little clarification of my own...the word fundamentalist, in NY, was considered a bad word as far as I knew, akin to fanatic. I never heard someone ever refer to themselves as a fundamentalist until I moved to Arizona. So when I posted originally that a pro would be not to listen to fundamentalists on the news, I was referring to the Osama's and Falwell's of the world....not anyone on this board.
I should have been more accurate and said fanatic, but then again, I think I was being pretty specific when I said on the news so that no-one would take it personally. But....you never know...so I thought I'd make myself clearer. | |
I loathe people who keep dogs. They are cowards who haven’t got the guts to bite people themselves. ~Sir Geoffrey Streatfield | |
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| | imwithstupid
Posts:21
| | 07/20/2007 7:13 PM |
Alert | Religion is nothing more than a way to 'control the masses'. Why do you think religion and politics are so intertwined? Put the fear of the unknown into them (like rotting in a pit of fire for all eternity (yeah right, whatever)), and people will do whatever you want them to.
Jessie Ventura said it best "religion is a crutch for weak-minded people".
If im going to hell, at least i'll be there with all of my friends. | | | |
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| | Jason
Posts:3378
| | 07/20/2007 11:49 PM |
Alert | | Saying 'religion is a crutch' is a merely a crutch for those who wish to gloss over the issue. | |
Joined: Jul 2005 | |
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| | rattle2
Posts:131
| | 07/21/2007 11:06 AM |
Alert | | What is your definition of a "crutch" Jason? | |
Sometimes we just make life to difficult.
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| | Jason
Posts:3378
| | 07/21/2007 2:41 PM |
Alert | | A crutch would be something someone relies on to avoid discussing the issue. So to say "religion is a crutch" is a crutch because it makes no statement about the issue. I don't rely on religion like a crutch but "imwithstupid" relies on that argument, presumably, because he/she has no other real argument. | |
Joined: Jul 2005 | |
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| | Jason
Posts:3378
| | 07/21/2007 2:42 PM |
Alert | Posted By Nothingtodo on 07/20/2007 8:15 AM
Does the maker of my computer really need my admiration? Doesn't that say something pretty immature about a God that would need admiration? Wasn't it enough to just create?
The computer was a bad example. How about your children? Wouldn't be too happy if they suddenly decided to not appreciate your love for them would you? How about if they began to question if you were really their parent? | |
Joined: Jul 2005 | |
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| | 06woman
Posts:356
| | 07/21/2007 3:00 PM |
Alert | Posted By EEE on 07/19/2007 9:48 AM
And EEE? Aren't you even a little bit tired of your accusation that not having God means not having a conscience?
I believe everybody has a conscience, both Theist and Atheist. Many Atheist argue they have morals because it helps preserve the human race. However, God gives ever person a conscience, by writing the laws on their heart. Man can't do good on their own. Rom 2:15 Which show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness... For context read: Rom 2:11-16
Do you even have any idea how absurd this sounds?  | |
"Happiness is a journey...not a destination."
"The highest form of ignorance is to reject something you know nothing about." -
Dr. Wayne W. Dyer
This is my son and a Lake Erie sunset. July 8,2007
Senior Member
Posts: 2268
Joined: May 2006 | |
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| | Nothingtodo
Posts:283
| | 07/21/2007 5:12 PM |
Alert | Posted By Jason on 07/21/2007 2:42 PM
The computer was a bad example. How about your children? Wouldn't be too happy if they suddenly decided to not appreciate your love for them would you? How about if they began to question if you were really their parent?
I'll be perfectly honest with you, Jason, I don't parent my children for their gratitude. I hope that they benefit from the love I give them, but I love them because I need to love them, because it gives me great joy. I don't need their gratitude for that.
While I'm sure I would feel bad if they weren't grateful, I guess I've never had to deal with ingratitude on their part because I don't demand it from them. | |
I loathe people who keep dogs. They are cowards who haven’t got the guts to bite people themselves. ~Sir Geoffrey Streatfield | |
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| | EEE
Posts:374
| | 07/21/2007 8:41 PM |
Alert | Posted By 06woman on 07/21/2007 3:00 PM Do you even have any idea how absurd this sounds?
I already expect everything I say to sound absurd to you.
For the word of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.(1 cor 1:18) | |
Yeah, it's true- He allowed the fall of man/
But He used it now to exalt the Lamb/
The Lord, who's wise, permits existence of sin/
to be glorified in His forgiveness to men/ | |
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| | TortosaGuy
Posts:682
| | 07/21/2007 11:51 PM |
Alert | | a world without religion.....hmmmmmm didnt john lennon have a song about that....yup thats right "Imagine"....too bad we dont live by those words....would be a more peaceful world...in my opinion anyhow | |
*formerly known as inyrfce2*
Senior Member
Posts: 797
Joined: Dec 2006 | |
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| | imwithstupid
Posts:21
| | 07/22/2007 11:15 AM |
Alert | i think weak-minded people need to have a feeling that theyre not going to rot in hell when they die. so they become 'born-again', and they feel secure. their 'crutch'. i dont need to have that security because i know that heaven and hell dont exist. and i am strong enough to not be scared into believing all that crap about 'being saved' and that if im not, i will go to hell. it is all man made fiction, made to control you.
if by chance their is a 'god' or a supreme being that created this universe, and im not saying that there is or isnt, i just dont believe that their is one single person on this planet that knows ANYTHING about what his/hers/its intentions are for us human beings and this existence here.
and i dont care that you want to believe in that. you have the right to think for yourself, and believe whatever you want. im just tired of all the bible-thumpers knocking on my door trying to scare me into believing it too. if your faith is so strong, why do you need me to share that faith with you? is it because if i believe it with you, then that will make you feel like that you having this faith is somehow more viable? it seems that all the god fearing people need others to share this faith with them, so they can feel its more believable. its as if they know that nobody has ANY SOLID PROOF that a god really exists, so it makes it easier for them to believe, if someone else does too.
and since jesus christ was only here 2000 years ago, what happened to all the souls of man that were here before him?
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| | Jason
Posts:3378
| | 07/22/2007 1:30 PM |
Alert | Posted By imwithstupid on 07/22/2007 11:15 AM
i think weak-minded people need to have a feeling that theyre not going to rot in hell when they die. so they become 'born-again', and they feel secure. their 'crutch'. i dont need to have that security because i know that heaven and hell dont exist. and i am strong enough to not be scared into believing all that crap about 'being saved' and that if im not, i will go to hell. it is all man made fiction, made to control you.
Weak-minded and crutch huh? So why is it that if you feel so secure in your opinion you have to insult and degrade other people?
im just tired of all the bible-thumpers knocking on my door trying to scare me into believing it too. if your faith is so strong, why do you need me to share that faith with you? is it because if i believe it with you, then that will make you feel like that you having this faith is somehow more viable? it seems that all the god fearing people need others to share this faith with them, so they can feel its more believable.
Ah and now we come to the real reason for your attack. You don't really feel all that secure in your opinion do you? Otherwise why would you be so upset?
its as if they know that nobody has ANY SOLID PROOF that a god really exists, so it makes it easier for them to believe, if someone else does too.
and since jesus christ was only here 2000 years ago, what happened to all the souls of man that were here before him?
Your question has an answer in the very book you refuse to read. Ignorance is worse than a "crutch". | |
Joined: Jul 2005 | |
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| | Veritas
Posts:250
| | 07/22/2007 10:33 PM |
Alert | To think that the reason Christians worship God is because God "needs" anything from us is preposterous. It flies in the face of the obvious and can only be meant as an ad hominem attack. We worship God because He is God ... no other reason. God needs nothing from anyone or thing, by definition, and whether or not the theist or atheist knows it. One does not need to be religious to recognize this most basic philosophical feature of belief in God. The fact that certain Christians on certain TV channels are kooky does not validate an ad hominem attack like the one given above. | | | |
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