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| | Author | Messages | |
Sinbad
Posts:3046
 | | 09/05/2007 2:24 PM |
 Alert | CLICK HERE for the full story
There's not much you can say about this one. This is why I have faith in a higher being that can give a person so much forgiveness for such a hateful crime.
Everyone always ask.."Why" to people that believe and this is a good reason why.
It boils down to your own personal relationship with your self and your belief's. If you could have done more in your life, to help someone better their own life. Would you put a stranger before yourself.
I just just think this is a good story is all...with a very sad ending.
Mabel Lopez had/has the right faith! | |
Just doing it one day at a time. Change is good and it should be looked upon as an improvment! not a problem.
______________________________________
***************************************
San Diego Super Chargers! GO!!!
Joined old forum March 2006
Post count: 3068 + these | |
| | BeerLeague2
Posts:111
| | 09/05/2007 3:11 PM |
Alert | I read this article earlier and thought how sad it was. Someone who gave so much to so many....and yet she was brutally murdered.
This is just one of the many reasons why I don't believe there is a god/goddess/higher being. What kind of "god" would allow this to happen to such a wonderful and giving person?
Yeah, all the believers will say that god has a plan....freewill...blah blah blah. All a bunch of sad excuses 
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| | motoman
Posts:35
| | 09/05/2007 4:11 PM |
Alert | Free-will is the truth, not a sad excuse. I want to propose a question for you to ponder. Would you prefer a mechanical world where God maneuvered everyone around on a string as though he were a marionette? This is the alternative to the options of choice we now enjoy. To remove choice in any and all matters is another way of saying you prefer to live your life mechanically, with dependence on another to make all the moves. Such an existence means you would have NO say in anything, not even the right to question God's purposes and objectives in creation. This is a privilege God is pleased to allow you to exercise.
This is how the Apostle Paul put it in Romans 9:20-24
No, don’t say that. Who are you, a mere human being, to argue with God? Should the thing that was created say to the one who created it, “Why have you made me like this?” 21 When a potter makes jars out of clay, doesn’t he have a right to use the same lump of clay to make one jar for decoration and another to throw garbage into? 22 In the same way, even though God has the right to show his anger and his power, he is very patient with those on whom his anger falls, who are destined for destruction. 23 He does this to make the riches of his glory shine even brighter on those to whom he shows mercy, who were prepared in advance for glory. 24 And we are among those whom he selected, both from the Jews and from the Gentiles.
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www.motoXriders.net | |
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| | BeerLeague2
Posts:111
| | 09/05/2007 5:01 PM |
Alert | Sounds like someone has been brainwashed
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| | motoman
Posts:35
| | 09/05/2007 5:20 PM |
Alert | I guess most great scientists are brainwashed then.
Check it out for yourself: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Christian_scientists
"Gravity explains the motions of the planets, but it cannot explain who set the planets in motion. God governs all things and knows all that is or can be done." Sir Isaac Newton | |
www.motoXriders.net | |
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| | Charmed
Posts:41
| | 09/05/2007 6:14 PM |
Alert | My brother recently left for the army and I'd had myself convinced that nothing bad could possibly happen to him because he is just such an amazing christian and God just would not let him die.
Recently I couldn't sleep because I was worried about him and I began to panic and sob like a baby. I realized that he wasn't safe just because he knows God, but the possibility of death doesn't seem to bother him a bit. I am scared of anything that has to do with death, flying, driving on the freeway, heights, anything that could lead to the possibility of death freaks me out. Why am I so scared of dying? Because, I believe in God. I fear God, but I wasn't listening to him. I hadn't been fallowing him, and it just hadn't seemed like much fun to me. I was scared of dying because I was scared of where I would go. My brother knows where he will go and I think Mabel Lopez knew as well.
I've come to realize that we are not Gods puppets, and I don't think that God turned his back on Mabel Lopez by letting her death happen. I believe he died for her so that she could live forever.
I've also decided to completely give my life to the lord and I'm finding out that it's a lot more fun than I thought that it would be! | |
studiocharme.com | |
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|  | BeerLeague2
Posts:111
| | 09/05/2007 8:13 PM |
Alert | I'm not scared of death either because I know where I will go...I will be worm food along with the rest of you.
It's too bad Mabel's "lord" didn't let her die peacefully in her sleep at a ripe old age. I guess that would have been too humane and kind. What an awful way to die | | | |
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| | stinkerbell2
Posts:0
| | 09/05/2007 10:49 PM |
Alert | Posted By BeerLeague2 on 09/05/2007 3:11 PM I read this article earlier and thought how sad it was. Someone who gave so much to so many....and yet she was brutally murdered. This is just one of the many reasons why I don't believe there is a god/goddess/higher being. What kind of "god" would allow this to happen to such a wonderful and giving person? Yeah, all the believers will say that god has a plan....freewill...blah blah blah. All a bunch of sad excuses
Ya know I have been amused by your "thinking" throught out this forum. It is people like you (those who have an opinion and feel it is the ONLY opinion)that make me glad I have FAITH in something else...cus if all I had to have faith in is the human race I would be angry and bitter too. Now I am not going to get in a religious tete a tete with you- I have my faith and you have yours (even if you dont "believe" in it you DO believe in something)SOMETIMES things happen- its not GOD letting them happen THEY JUST HAPPEN-So many of us feel the need to control things that we forget we have very little control over anything!
Maybe things happen not out of a persons belief or non belief, whether they are good or bad, but to teach those around them something. How they lived their life, how they affected others. Like a stone being thrown in a pond-how those ripples reach the shore and what those ripples touch.
Will I be worm food too? YES but I really dont care what becomes of my body- I only care about what happens to my spirit- both here on earth and in "the great beyond".
You should know I dont normally post to these types of thread because I equate it to banging my head on the wall- Lets just say I know when to say when and I know when to leave a dead horse alone and no longer beat it.
Have a nice day | | | |
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| | Jason
Posts:3378
| | 09/07/2007 10:21 AM |
Alert | Posted By BeerLeague2 on 09/05/2007 5:01 PM Sounds like someone has been brainwashed
Sounds like someone can't come up with an original argument.
I'm not scared of death either because I know where I will go...I will be worm food along with the rest of you.
So why is it motoman is brainwashed and you aren't? You've just got a different popular opinion, why is yours right? | |
Joined: Jul 2005 | |
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| | Sinbad
Posts:3046
| | 09/07/2007 10:33 AM |
Alert | Posted By BeerLeague2 on 09/05/2007 3:11 PM I read this article earlier and thought how sad it was. Someone who gave so much to so many....and yet she was brutally murdered. This is just one of the many reasons why I don't believe there is a god/goddess/higher being. What kind of "god" would allow this to happen to such a wonderful and giving person? Yeah, all the believers will say that god has a plan....freewill...blah blah blah. All a bunch of sad excuses
One that was ready for her to come home to be with him. Maybe he felt it was time for her to come home to him and leave her mark as a reminder of "FAITH". | |
Just doing it one day at a time. Change is good and it should be looked upon as an improvment! not a problem.
______________________________________
***************************************
San Diego Super Chargers! GO!!!
Joined old forum March 2006
Post count: 3068 + these | |
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| | Jason
Posts:3378
| | 09/07/2007 11:38 AM |
Alert | This is just one of the many reasons why I don't believe there is a god/goddess/higher being. What kind of "god" would allow this to happen to such a wonderful and giving person?
What kind of person does it take to decide how someone should die? What kind of knowledge? Who is any of us to decide exactly how anyone should die? | |
Joined: Jul 2005 | |
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| | EEE
Posts:374
| | 09/07/2007 7:57 PM |
Alert | Posted By BeerLeague2
This is just one of the many reasons why I don't believe there is a god/goddess/higher being. What kind of "god" would allow this to happen to such a wonderful and giving person?
Sometimes the self proclaimed "Rational Thinkers" are the most Irrational thinkers.
Let's see if this makes sense:
God does not exist because bad things happen to good people.
God does not exist because death happens.
God does not exist because ........
These statements are irrational and very illogical!!! 
The problem is you and others have created you own definition of God instead of accepting the God of the bible. You and many others don't like the God of the bible, because it doesn't match your definition of God.
The fact is, the death and corruption seen today actually proves the God of the Bible exist, because the bible explains why there is death and corruption today! We live in a fallen world, a fallen world in need of a Savior. | |
Yeah, it's true- He allowed the fall of man/
But He used it now to exalt the Lamb/
The Lord, who's wise, permits existence of sin/
to be glorified in His forgiveness to men/ | |
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| | BeerLeague2
Posts:111
| | 09/07/2007 9:15 PM |
Alert | Whoa, people of god! Chill out a little, okay? I was just verbalizing my opinion that there is no god/goddess/supreme being. Now I was not raised with this opinion--I was a good little church-going, private-school attending, jesus-fearing girl for many many years. I've had much formal christian religious education, and even more informal self study of all the other major religons of the world. So obviously I am an open-minded person who is not scared to ask questions. I am neither illogical or irrational (okay, maybe for like five days a month...)
It is after 40 years of reading, listening, discussing, researching and learning that I have come to this conclusion. I am in a minority in the US, so I often get angry and frustrated when those who are in the majority try to push their religious beliefs on me and my atheist brethren. I don't like my tax dollars going to support religious causes, and I don't like the eliteist attitudes of many of the so-called christians I meet who look down on me because I am not "saved". I am my own savior. You are your own savior. We all have the power within us to make things happen. We can't just be lazy and hope/pray that all our problems will magically disappear if we talk to a god enough.
I'm sorry if any of you are offended by my beliefs or actions. Really, I am....because I am generally a very nice, thoughtful person--as are most of the atheists I know. We hold the door open for you at stores, we let you in traffic when no one else will and we bake you cookies at christmastime, not because we believe what you believe, but because it's important to you.
Most studies show that about 14% of Americans are atheists. There are more who call themselves agnostics, because they fear what others will think of them if they say the big, scary "A" word. Even more call themselves christians or jews or whatever--not really because they believe in the religion but because it's family tradition or they're just not curious enough to really do the research.
We are everywhere. We are your teachers, neighbors, elected officials and friends. Most of us are well-educated and come from christian families. We are knowlege-seekers and critical thinkers. Some of us can be a little pushy about our philosophy--not because we want to put down your beliefs, but we just want to enlighten, empower and educate so we can share the world with other critical thinkers.
I'll probably continue to throw out my off-the-cuff comments on this board because it's just way more interesting than most of what goes on here. So if you think BeerLeague is an idiot, then just ignore my rants and go back to your word games or prayers or whatever. The big bad atheists will not be taking over the world anytime soon, so your life will not change.
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| | Jason
Posts:3378
| | 09/07/2007 10:35 PM |
Alert | I am neither illogical or irrational
EEE wasn't saying you are, but your argument was and is.
It is after 40 years of reading, listening, discussing, researching and learning that I have come to this conclusion. I am in a minority in the US, so I often get angry and frustrated when those who are in the majority try to push their religious beliefs on me and my atheist brethren. I don't like my tax dollars going to support religious causes, and I don't like the eliteist attitudes of many of the so-called christians I meet who look down on me because I am not "saved". I am my own savior. You are your own savior. We all have the power within us to make things happen. We can't just be lazy and hope/pray that all our problems will magically disappear if we talk to a god enough.
This is the part I really don't understand. In one sentence, you express your disdain for other religions getting their message out, but then go on the attack by shoving your beliefs down everyone else's throat (OK, eyes in this case). Not everyone believes that they are their own savior, yet you have no qualms about stating it as if it were fact. Not a belief, but fact. Not only that, but you go on to call people with faith lazy! You say they're brainwashed. You'd get your message across a lot better if you didn't attack so much (ironic, since that's what you complain Christians do).
We hold the door open for you at stores, we let you in traffic when no one else will and we bake you cookies at christmastime, not because we believe what you believe, but because it's important to you.
So does everyone of practically every religion. What is your point?
Some of us can be a little pushy about our philosophy--not because we want to put down your beliefs, but we just want to enlighten, empower and educate so we can share the world with other critical thinkers.
There is a line between pushy and arrogant self-righteousness. So many atheists seem to pole-vault right over that line. Yes, so do religious people, but I thought atheism was about rationalism, not attacking and demeaning. | |
Joined: Jul 2005 | |
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| | BeerLeague2
Posts:111
| | 09/07/2007 10:50 PM |
Alert | | Sorry Jason, I don't care to engage in any sort of debate with you. I feel you're emotional and argumentative and that's just not interesting to me in any way. | | | |
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| | drummer72
Posts:3605
| | 09/07/2007 10:53 PM |
Alert | | GO BEARS!! | |
"Everything for everyone and nothing for ourselves" | |
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| | Jason
Posts:3378
| | 09/08/2007 12:00 AM |
Alert | Who said this was an argument? I don't want it to be one and it doesn't have to be one, just don't expect such rude comments to slide.
I've been accused a lot of things on here, but being too emotional? That's new! 
On some topics I like to have in-depth discussions and it may seem like I'm being argumentative, but that's the best I can do (for reasons I won't get into). For those conversations where people don't want to get into an in-depth discussion, they should just say so and not try to blame the opponent (straw man anyone?) | |
Joined: Jul 2005 | |
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| | motoman
Posts:35
| | 09/08/2007 8:21 AM |
Alert | Most people who do not believe in God consider themselves agnostic and not atheist because that is a more logical conclusion. NOT because they are looked down on by other religions that believe in a God.
Let me explain, to say there is NO god would be like saying there is no gold in China. You would need all knowledge of china to make this statement. What is under ground, in any river, around anyones kneck, or even in their mouth. So to say there is no god, you would have to have all knowledge of the universe. This may seem like an absurb argument to you but, lets say that you knew 1% of all the knowledge in the world. Obvioulsly there is not even a single person that even comes close to this, but lets say you are the most intelligent person and know 1%, are you telling me that in the other 99% of knowledge that you do no know, that there could be clear evidence of God. That is why most people who do not believe in a higher power are agnostic. | |
www.motoXriders.net | |
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| | Devil Dog
Posts:411
| | 09/18/2007 5:19 AM |
Alert | Posted By BeerLeague2 on 09/07/2007 9:15 PM Whoa, people of god! Chill out a little, okay? I was just verbalizing my opinion
You R A RETARD! It is impossible to Verbalize through Typing. You Must be a Howard Stern Fan - Naming your self Beer League 2 - "L" Loser. I find it ammusing how you always comment on Christian threads and then get offended after you alienate all of the Christians on it.
THERE ARE NO ATHIESTS IN THE FOX HOLE. | |
"Always Moving Forward" | |
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| | BeerLeague2
Posts:111
| | 09/18/2007 4:41 PM |
Alert | Posted By Devil Dog on 09/18/2007 5:19 AM Posted By BeerLeague2 on 09/07/2007 9:15 PM Whoa, people of god! Chill out a little, okay? I was just verbalizing my opinion You R A RETARD! It is impossible to Verbalize through Typing. You Must be a Howard Stern Fan - Naming your self Beer League 2 - "L" Loser. I find it ammusing how you always comment on Christian threads and then get offended after you alienate all of the Christians on it. THERE ARE NO ATHIESTS IN THE FOX HOLE.
What a nice, christian-like response. You should be proud of yourself for being so christ-like. Now go to church and ask for forgiveness.
BTW, there are MANY atheists in foxholes. We are everywhere.
http://www.atheistfoxholes.org/
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