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| | Author | Messages | |
GilaGuy
Posts:789
 | | 10/18/2007 2:51 PM |
 Alert | | I'm a bit confused as to how XBOX Live works. I thought it was a subscription service, but a friend told me that there is also a free service as well. Is this true? If so, what are the differences between the two? | | | |
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| | Trogdor!
Posts:294
| | 10/18/2007 3:58 PM |
Alert | From xbox.com:
Silver Level (free)
* Create your gamer profile
* Create and maintain a friends list
* Access Xbox Live Marketplace including Xbox Live Arcade, demos, and trailers
* Send and receive text and voice messages
* Join in special Xbox Live Gold trial opportunities
* Access massively multiplayer games
Gold Level (subscription)
All the Silver level benefits PLUS:
* Great online multiplayer gameplay
* Xbox Live Marketplace: Get both exclusive and early access content
* Revolutionary TrueSkill™ matchmaking
* Enhanced gamer feedback
* Enhanced friends list management
Basically, you pay for online multiplayer (except for MMOs, ie Final Fantasy XI). | |
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| | GilaGuy
Posts:789
| | 10/18/2007 4:32 PM |
Alert | <div class='NTForums_Quote'>Posted By Trogdor! on 10/18/2007 3:58 PM
From xbox.com:
<div class='NTForums_Quote'>
Silver Level (free)
* Create your gamer profile
* Create and maintain a friends list
* Access Xbox Live Marketplace including Xbox Live Arcade, demos, and trailers
* Send and receive text and voice messages
* Join in special Xbox Live Gold trial opportunities
* Access massively multiplayer games
Gold Level (subscription)
All the Silver level benefits PLUS:
* Great online multiplayer gameplay
* Xbox Live Marketplace: Get both exclusive and early access content
* Revolutionary TrueSkill™ matchmaking
* Enhanced gamer feedback
* Enhanced friends list management
</div>
Basically, you pay for online multiplayer (except for MMOs, ie Final Fantasy XI).</div>
Ahh, ok that makes sense, thank you. So basically, if I wanted to play Madden over XBox Live, I'd need a paid subscription.
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| | JasonY
Posts:3330
| | 10/22/2007 3:23 PM |
Alert | | Use the $400-500 towards a PC and you will get more for your money. Dual-core, 256MB graphics card, 2GB of RAM......... | |
"My favorite health club is the International House of Pancakes" -- Lewis Black | |
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| | Pizzaking
Posts:254
| | 10/24/2007 6:31 AM |
Alert | | My PC is already decent in the gaming department. Processor could use upgrading (P4 2.8)but Im running 8600gt OCed 256 vid with 2gig ram. Not forking out for the 8800gts till it drops a little. Runs Unreal Tourney 3 and WOW on the high setting just fine. Im just looking to get back into the sports gaming and also the 360 would be the kids. | |
Pizzaking
Wasnt a member
0 posts | |
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| | JasonY
Posts:3330
| | 10/24/2007 8:26 AM |
Alert | | I got a PS2 for $129 brand new this week and it is a blast. Games aren't bad on price either... | |
"My favorite health club is the International House of Pancakes" -- Lewis Black | |
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|  | Mr. Whitefolks
Posts:63
| | 10/29/2007 3:44 PM |
Alert | The 360 is a great machine and Live is a wonderful service. We play a lot of Madden, Tiger Woods and the Tom Clancy games. Call of Duty 4 comes out soon and that should be awesome.
Gametag: jjlongo | |
"We are overcome by anguish at this illogical moment of humanity.” - Che
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| | Lurker
Posts:35
| | 10/30/2007 10:12 AM |
Alert | Xbox live is by far the best online gaming utility and system for a console. With that said it will never compare to the amount of diversity you can achieve and customization of a PC.
Many games will not be coming to the console market and if some of them do will never have the accessibility as a PC. World of Warcraft and most MMO's is a prime example of this.
Console system are far superior to PC's when it comes to fighting games, most (not all) 3rd person action/adventure games/platformers, and sports titles. However, for everything else they are far inferior. Real time strategy games, FPS, MMO RPG games, point and click hack and slash, etc.
Most of the games you mentioned Unreal, WoW, HL and CS are all going to have a better experience on the PC hands down. If you are going to buy a console system for multiplayer purposes for these times of games you are wasting your time, because the consoles systems just can not compete with the amount of “stuff” that is out there for the PC. Consoles are just NOW starting to tap into the mod community, but again it will be quite sometime before you are start seeing stuff similar to what the computer has had for 20 years.
By saying this I am not trying to stop you from buying a 360, by all means it is an amazing system (I also own a PS3 and a Wii which are both amazing as well). Game exclusives like Mass Effect and Too Human as well as non-exclusives like Assassins Creed, Soul Caliber 4 will all make the console a great experience.
Overall PC and 360 are just different, but if you are thinking about playing the games you just mentioned on a console you are going to be very disappointed with the lack of control…why do you think most game devs refuse to allow PC players to play against console  . Lastly, there are a lot of restriction on a 360 for multiplayer compared to a PC…but overall if you are looking at playing some sports games online are you are going to have a blast.
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| | Jason
Posts:3378
| | 10/30/2007 1:00 PM |
Alert | | You could also get the new 8800GT, which is based on the G92 graphics core and looks to be almost as good as the 8800GTX, but only costs about $200-$250. Run two in SLI and you'll certainly have better performance for less money. | |
Joined: Jul 2005 | |
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| | jamest
Posts:68
| | 10/30/2007 2:15 PM |
Alert | Like everyone has said certain games are better on certain systems, bought the Orange Box for my PC and Guitar Hero on the 360...
Absolutely love Xbox live arcade, so many fun little games you can spend a few minutes playing or even a few hours, and for the most part they are dirt cheap. | | | |
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| | Trogdor!
Posts:294
| | 10/30/2007 3:15 PM |
Alert | With that said it will never compare to the amount of diversity you can achieve and customization of a PC.
True, but I would argue that most people don't want to make yearly upgrades just to play new games. Sure, you don't have to upgrade you system, but who wants to just meet the min requirements to play a game?
Many games will not be coming to the console market and if some of them do will never have the accessibility as a PC. World of Warcraft and most MMO's is a prime example of this.
That may change if/when consoles become more compatible with a keyboard & mouse. All 3 current gen consoles have some sort of keyboard support.
Console system are far superior to PC's when it comes to fighting games, most (not all) 3rd person action/adventure games/platformers, and sports titles. However, for everything else they are far inferior. Real time strategy games, FPS, MMO RPG games, point and click hack and slash, etc.
While I agree with RTS, point & click (Diabloesque games), and MMORPG (currently), there was an article I read a while back that talked about Shadowrun for the PC & 360. As some of you may know, this is a FPS that features cross-platform multiplayer. People playing on a PC could play against people on a 360. Initially, the writers of the article thought that their players on PCs would have a clear advantage, but as the they played, it turned out that there was no advantage.
I however am planning on having a get together with 6 or 7 of my friends to create a nice little lan party. Games like Team Fortress, C&C 3, and many others.
Another nice thing about a console is that it's a lot easier to bring over to a friend's house for LAN parties. The last thing you want to do is accidentally drop your expensive gaming rig!
FPS games are a console are a joke on top of graphic intensive sense that cause slow downs on your 360 can not be rectified. I played gears of war, halo 3 and team fortress 2 on my 360 and all of them while playing multiplayer have extreme slow downs during nice size fire fights…there will NEVER be anything you can do to improve it
I think it all depends on whether or not the game was originally designed to be played using a controller or keyboard & mouse. Halo & Gears control very well using a 360 controller, but TF2 takes a lot more effort. I honestly can't imagine trying to play Gears on a PC, but would actually prefer a mouse & keyboard for TF2.
Any slow down that I've ever experienced was more due to network lag rather than the system not being able to keep up. TF2 does have some pretty bad lag issues, but Valve has already released some patches that are aimed at rectifying those issues.
This system cost me about 1’500 dollars (I never bought all these out right, some of these things I have had in my computer for 2 years or more)
Once you factor in annual/bi-annual upgrades, that price will increase significantly. I won't have to upgrade my $400 Xbox until the next generation comes out (at least 5 years or so). | |
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| | JasonY
Posts:3330
| | 10/30/2007 3:31 PM |
Alert | For sports games I play my PS2, for everything else my PC.
Starcraft II comes out next year! | |
"My favorite health club is the International House of Pancakes" -- Lewis Black | |
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| | Lurker
Posts:35
| | 10/30/2007 3:57 PM |
Alert | Price may increase with a computer, but again you can do a lot more on a computer then you can on a console. It is a multiplatform device that can be use for work, education, entertainment, creativity, etc.
While again I understand shelling out 300-400 dollars a year can be pricing at times, you do have think of the plethora of things you can do compared to how many things you can not do with an ordinary 400-500 dollar console, then compound how much it costs to by all the accessories and constantly have to pay your x-box live (50-60 dollars a controller, HDMI cables, 60 dollar x box live gold membership).
If you are going to be talking about a mid-high end PC here we have to be talking about someone then that is going to want the best of the best on their x box, then you have to factor in it is about 10-20 dollars more for the games on the 360 then on the PC (if we are talking about normal games TF2 for example, cost me 45 dollars on steam and costs the xbox ppl 60 bucks).
In the age of digital distribution how much longer until you small 100GB hard drive will fill up with mp3's, pictures, videos, demo's, patches, save games, etc. compared to an average computer now coming with 300-400gb....there is more then an ounce of validity to my argument.
TCO (Total Cost of Ownership) for a 360 vs PC in 5 years is going to be only slightly higher on a PC possibly by a 200 dollars.
1'000 for the PC plus 400 (afer 2 1/2 years for new vid. card and mid range processor)...so 1400 dollars for full system
400, plus accessories 200, plus price difference buying an average of 3 games a year (200)...plus 5 years of xbox live 300 (I understand MMO's require $, but most PC multiplayer games do not require you to pay anything for multiplayer support)...we are now sitting at about a 300 dollar price difference....personally, that is nothing in 5 years. <img src='http://www.85239.com/desktopmodules/ntforums/images/emoticons/sad.gif' height='20' width='20' border='0' title='Sad' align='absmiddle'>
Yes there are pros and cons for each system, but overall the PC has more to offer.
Edit: Forgot that most additional content on your Xbox costs you money, while the PC will not cost you anything...most mods give you additional content for free (Besides Oblivion's, that sucks for both PC/Xbox ppl)
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| | Jason
Posts:3378
| | 10/30/2007 6:16 PM |
Alert | True, but I would argue that most people don't want to make yearly upgrades just to play new games. Sure, you don't have to upgrade you system, but who wants to just meet the min requirements to play a game?
If you invest in a system that is more than just budget components when you build your computer, you'll be able to go for more than a year without upgrades and still make more than the minimum requirements.
On the other hand, with a console you're stuck with what the console can do for 3-5 years.
Another nice thing about a console is that it's a lot easier to bring over to a friend's house for LAN parties.
Have you seen Shuttle systems?
Once you factor in annual/bi-annual upgrades, that price will increase significantly. I won't have to upgrade my $400 Xbox until the next generation comes out (at least 5 years or so).
You have to deal with RRoDs, plus you can't factor in the whole cost of the computer since it does quite a bit more than gaming. Like JasonY said, by the time you factor in all of the accessories, the membership, the repairs, the upgrades (increased capacity XBox HDD anyone?) and then you compare to all the computer can do, I don't think the difference will be as stark as you make it seem.
I honestly can't imagine trying to play Gears on a PC
Didn't you know that XBox controllers work on the PC?
Any slow down that I've ever experienced was more due to network lag rather than the system not being able to keep up.
Forza 2 has some occasional problems... | |
Joined: Jul 2005 | |
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| | digitard
Posts:6
| | 10/30/2007 8:03 PM |
Alert | Each have their perks, and drawbacks. But, being an avid PC gamer (online) since 1998 (Tribes) and a XBOX 360 owner since May 2006 I have to give the XB360 the edge when it comes to online communities.
I have both (decent PC, 360 and a wii for fun) and I spend more time on my XB360 due to the ease of use, extreme community integration and the fact all my friends can play the same game I can in the same quality w/o having to worry about their current rig... it's just appealing to me.
Hopefully I STILL get a great connection when I move (hopefully within a month) to RED. | | | |
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| | Lurker
Posts:35
| | 10/30/2007 10:25 PM |
Alert | Xfire, FTW as well as the new "Steam Community"
I am able to see exactly what everyone is playing when they are playing and how long they have been playing the games, jump right into the servers they are on and even have private voice chat.
I have over 90 friends on Xfire and about 30 on Steam Community. Again, if you do not know how to utilize your PC then most likely you are not going to have that much fun with it. Just like if no one ever payed the monthly or yearly for that matter fee for Xbox live they would not be utilizing the xbox.
I find the xfire is far superior and I do not have to fight with 10 menus to get to what I want. It is quick and easy without the hassle of having to move around with a a controller.
I have been playing PC games avidly since 1997, but I was always into console gaming...and by far my favorite system to date was the SNES. Of the "next-gen" crowd consoles, I have to say the Wii and not for the games, but mainly because it is the only real next gen console. With all the other systems you are just paying for a revamped version of the previous generation, whereas the Wii has potential to revolutionize the way we play games. As they improve on the technology (much like the NES improved on the ATARI) it will be an even better experiance. | | | |
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| | Trogdor!
Posts:294
| | 10/31/2007 10:42 AM |
Alert | If you invest in a system that is more than just budget components when you build your computer, you'll be able to go for more than a year without upgrades and still make more than the minimum requirements.
On the other hand, with a console you're stuck with what the console can do for 3-5 years.
The problem is that initial investment, especially since most people already have a PC and have a hard time justifying purchasing a top-of-the-line rig just for gameing. As for being stuck with a console, that also means not having to worry about upgrades and you also have to consider that some of the best games on any console come towards the end of its life line.
Have you seen Shuttle systems?
You're forgetting about the screen, speakers/headphones, keyboard, and mouse. It's still easier to fit everything I need into a backpack, and I don't have to worry about carrying around this huge investment.
You have to deal with RRoDs, plus you can't factor in the whole cost of the computer since it does quite a bit more than gaming. Like JasonY said, by the time you factor in all of the accessories, the membership, the repairs, the upgrades (increased capacity XBox HDD anyone?) and then you compare to all the computer can do, I don't think the difference will be as stark as you make it seem.
RRoDs aren't as much a problem anymore since they're moving to the newer chipset and are using better cooling. As for the extras, the only thing above and beyond the initial purchase is an Xbox Live Gold membership and maybe a recharge kit for your controlller. The HDD is plenty big if you delete demos once your done with them.
Didn't you know that XBox controllers work on the PC?
Right, but the argument was that FPSs and better on the PC. The standard PC interface is keyboard & mouse.
Forza 2 has some occasional problems...
Never played that, so I wouldn't know.
I'm not trying to say that the 360 is a vastly better gaming option over a PC, but it is a lot more accessible for the average user. There's so much hassle involved with having a gaming PC. The majority of people wouldn't even know where to start (what kind of hardware should they purchase). Then you have to look at screens, speakers/headphones/both, keyboards, mice, etc. Even if you get help with all of that, what happens when you need to upgrade or something goes wrong... time to get more help. If you're already a "techie" these aren't that big of problems and it may even be enjoyable for you to shop around (trust me, I'd agree), but again, not for most. You also need to find a place to set all of this up.
An Xbox 360 is a lot more "plug & play". You probably already have an HDTV, surround sound, and a high speed internet connection... just buy a console and plug it in. | |
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| | Jason
Posts:3378
| | 10/31/2007 10:56 AM |
Alert | I'm still not buying the portability argument. It's a lot easier to carry a small case, a 19-22" monitor, headphones, keyboard and mouse, as opposed to a system, gigantic brick of a PSU, controllers, and 32-50+" TV. And upgrades are definitely an issue: there's controllers, HDD (yes, because people will want the increased capacity to store more music, downloads and HD video), accessories (cooling kits anyone?), and more.
You're definitely right on the ease of use aspect though, but for the wrong reason. Computers are generally more difficult, but if more people learned how to maintain and prevent problems with their computer, we wouldn't be in the spyware/malware mess that we are in today. We would not expect people to just randomly install parts on their car's engine, so why should they randomly trust drive-by-downloads on the PC? Someone didn't teach them.
So yes, for your average target market that wants to just plug it in and have it work? Yes, the 360 is better. I just don't think its right, the level of ignorance that the average consumer has about technology. | |
Joined: Jul 2005 | |
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| | Trogdor!
Posts:294
| | 10/31/2007 11:26 AM |
Alert | I'm still not buying the portability argument. It's a lot easier to carry a small case, a 19-22" monitor, headphones, keyboard and mouse, as opposed to a system, gigantic brick of a PSU, controllers, and 32-50+" TV. And upgrades are definitely an issue: there's controllers, HDD (yes, because people will want the increased capacity to store more music, downloads and HD video), accessories (cooling kits anyone?), and more.
The PSU is not that big. As i said, I'm easily able to fit everything that I need in my backpack. Most people have more than 1 TV, so I don't need to haul a 32-50" tv with me. If and extra screen is needed, I have a small projector that I can bring along (as of yet, I have not had to use it).
As for upgrades:
- Controllers: What upgrades? Rechargeable battery packs?
- HDD: Yyou're forgetting that the 360 is a media center extender. A lot of those things can simply be stored on your PC. You can also plug in an external HDD or iPod for your music.
- Cooling kits: Seriously, only fools go for these. Cooling isn't as much of an issue as it once was, anyway.
- Other accessories: The only extra thing that I had to buy is my Xbox Live subscription... oh, and an HDMI cable.
I just don't think its right, the level of ignorance that the average consumer has about technology.
That's called job security! LOL! I don't like it much either, but the fact still remains that that level ignorance exists. Not everyone can be an expert, nor does everyone want to be an expert with technology. I can't wait to get my hands on the latest & greatest tech, but my wife couldn't care less. | |
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| | Lurker
Posts:35
| | 10/31/2007 12:26 PM |
Alert | Trust me I understand what you are saying, I started on consoles ever since the 80's and I have never been without at least one of the latest gen systems starting all the way back to the ATARI 2600. However, I used to be the ignorant one about computers when my parents finally decided to invest in one in 1997 (only 10 years ago, lol)....I only used it to go on AOL and chat with people and stayed far away from the PC Gaming market.
Until, one day my friend showed me a PC game that goes by the little name of "Ultima Online" and I watched him do things on a PC that you could only dream about on a console (remember this was still the N64 age when four play golden eye was the pinnacle peak of life it self).
I have all the systems, but I find that overall the games on the console now a days are just rehashes of stuff that the PC has done before, including technology (Excluding most RPG/Racing/Fighting).
I enjoy consoles as much as the next person, they do have some great games Guitar Hero, Folklore, God of War, Shadows of the Colossus, Mass Effect, Rachet and Clank, Forza, Metriod, Zelda, FF, etc. however people tend to forget about the both the positives and negatives on there all might console and think it is the be all end all.
The PC is not the “be all end all” either, as I have mentioned the genres they are very poor at, but there are many areas that the PC has always been ahead of the consoles in every generation that has passed.
Truthfully, I do not usually watch TV on my 46’’ LCD…most of my television is watched through my computer and I can always record shows directly to my hard drive without the hassle of DVR stuff. You can take sometime and allow your computer to pretty much run your whole entire home theater setup…it is pretty amazing when you have a game that supports 7.1 surround sound, when most movies/console games are sitting pretty at 5.1….there is just a long list of positives and all consoles are doing is pretty to capture and copy the essence of a PC in there own way.
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