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| | Author | Messages | |
Sinbad
Posts:3058
 | | 11/17/2007 9:02 AM |
 Alert | My argument has always been consistent: catch the dangerous drivers. When I say "speeders" I mean people driving too fast for the conditions.
speeder is a Speeder
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Just doing it one day at a time. Change is good and it should be looked upon as an improvment! not a problem.
______________________________________
***************************************
San Diego Super Chargers! GO!!!
Joined old forum March 2006
Post count: 3068 + these | |
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| | Sinbad
Posts:3058
| | 11/17/2007 9:16 AM |
Alert | #1) Your speedometer is not 100% accurate. This is a fact, and it is allowed to be up to 3% off.
This is a very weak statement to justify going OVER the speed limit....
but also by pacing the other car, you qualify for the section of Title 28 that defines racing on highways. You also qualify for driving too slow for the conditions.
Doesn't hold WATER my friend
Does that help clarify my position?
yes it does.,., Let's just see what the Camera thinks about Your Speeding. | |
Just doing it one day at a time. Change is good and it should be looked upon as an improvment! not a problem.
______________________________________
***************************************
San Diego Super Chargers! GO!!!
Joined old forum March 2006
Post count: 3068 + these | |
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| | Sinbad
Posts:3058
| | 11/17/2007 9:33 AM |
Alert | <div class='NTForums_Quote'>Posted By Jason on 11/16/2007 1:57 AM
<div class='NTForums_Quote'>Wow.. that sounds a little SELF-Centered to me.Forget the speeding laws and Don't you dare get in my way when I am trying to drive 70-80 mph....Which is faster than the LAWS or the SAFETY person has deemed safe for this road.
Man... you need a bigger clue.... here's two more dollars.. you're going to need a bigger clue. </div>
Apparently you <i>can't</i> read. I said I'm happy to go 65.</div>
You are sooo busted... You are not happy going 65 mph... did you for get what you said on page 4? here let me quote you!
<div class='NTForums_Quote'>Posted By Jason on 11/14/2007 11:19 AM
I wouldn't care if I was stuck in traffic going 65 all the way home but it's never like that any more. There's always some jerk leading the line speeding up and slowing down. 55->50->60->70->60. You get the idea. No one can pass or everyone who can is too chicken or absorbed in their cell phone call or something. I actually like it now when I get stuck at Riggs and I'm in the front of the line. I get to put some distance between me and them and set the cruise for 70-80 depending on the conditions. I know that my drive will be far safer than the people who are stuck behind the control freaks.</div>
That my firend is End of the STORY. You can't have it both ways... Being happy to drive 65 but can't wait to drive 70-80 mph.
It just doesn't work like that. Speeding is Speeding. Don't go on the Photo Enforcement thread and say you would be glad to have all of the speeders caught then come on this thread and sing the praise of going 70-80 mph... Posted SPEED LIMIT FRIEND!
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Just doing it one day at a time. Change is good and it should be looked upon as an improvment! not a problem.
______________________________________
***************************************
San Diego Super Chargers! GO!!!
Joined old forum March 2006
Post count: 3068 + these | |
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| | Jason
Posts:3378
| | 11/17/2007 12:16 PM |
Alert | | . | |
Joined: Jul 2005 | |
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| | Jason
Posts:3378
| | 11/17/2007 12:19 PM |
Alert | That my firend is End of the STORY. You can't have it both ways... Being happy to drive 65 but can't wait to drive 70-80 mph.
Man you just don't get it. I said I'd be happy to go 65, if traffic flowed smoothly, even though I'd prefer to go faster. It's called shades of gray, because rarely is any situation black and white like you're trying to make it. | |
Joined: Jul 2005 | |
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| | Jason
Posts:3378
| | 11/17/2007 12:23 PM |
Alert | According to Jason A cop can sit at a traffic light and site you for racing as soon as the light turns green for racing because you took off at the same rate of speed as the driver next to you.
Wrong! You didn't read the law, which clearly shows that there has to be intent.
This tells me that if I am doing 65 ( +/- Jason's 3% ) and another driver is doing 60 ( +/- Jason's 3% ) I am ok to travel in the left lane even though the rest of traffic is wanting to do 80 ( +/- Jason's 3% ).
Yes, that's perfectly acceptable. I'm not upset with that.
I feel the law means slower traffic as to mean going under the maximum posted speed ( +/- Jason's 3% ).
Again, please post the exact wording of the law that says that. Until you can find that, I'll refer you back to the section that says "normal speed" of traffic. Here's a clue: if you are not passing the car in the right lane, and you have a mile long line of cars built up, you're going less than the "normal speed" of traffic. Even if this is the speed limit. And before you protest, I was pulled over by an officer for this, so I know. | |
Joined: Jul 2005 |
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|  | Jason
Posts:3378
| | 11/17/2007 12:25 PM |
Alert | Posted By Sinbad on 11/17/2007 9:16 AM #1) Your speedometer is not 100% accurate. This is a fact, and it is allowed to be up to 3% off. This is a very weak statement to justify going OVER the speed limit....
 3% is 3% in either direction. If your speedometer is off by 3% you could either be a SPEEDER TOO Sinbad or if you're in the left lane and it is reading 3% higher than your actual speed, you're breaking all sorts of laws.
but also by pacing the other car, you qualify for the section of Title 28 that defines racing on highways. You also qualify for driving too slow for the conditions.
Doesn't hold WATER my friend
Yeah, only if you chop up my sentences.  | |
Joined: Jul 2005 | |
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| | Grilladawg
Posts:219
| | 11/17/2007 1:00 PM |
Alert | ^ ^ ^
now you're just talking to yourself...lol | | | |
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| | geewiz
Posts:482
| | 11/17/2007 1:20 PM |
Alert |
Again, please post the exact wording of the law that says that. Until you can find that, I'll refer you back to the section that says "normal speed" of traffic. Here's a clue: if you are not passing the car in the right lane, and you have a mile long line of cars built up, you're going less than the "normal speed" of traffic. Even if this is the speed limit. And before you protest, I was pulled over by an officer for this, so I know.
Read the first definition of normal
The law sets a standard speed which is 55 or 65 on 347 outside the city limits.
nor·mal /ˈnɔrməl/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[nawr-muhl] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–adjective
1. conforming to the standard or the common type; usual; not abnormal; regular; natural.
2. serving to establish a standard.
3. Psychology. a. approximately average in any psychological trait, as intelligence, personality, or emotional adjustment.
b. free from any mental disorder; sane.
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Be strong ARMY STRONG America's backbone. | |
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| | Jason
Posts:3378
| | 11/17/2007 2:21 PM |
Alert | | Yes, the first definition says "usual" and "regular". What does everyone complain the "usual" speed is on 347? Certainly not 65 is it? | |
Joined: Jul 2005 | |
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| | geewiz
Posts:482
| | 11/17/2007 4:57 PM |
Alert | | Since the law trumps the law breakers ( speeders) I will travel in the left lane at 65 as long as I wish. | |
Be strong ARMY STRONG America's backbone. | |
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| | Jason
Posts:3378
| | 11/18/2007 12:59 AM |
Alert | | One question for Sinbad: What is the speed (not a answer like "the speed limit") you go south of Casa Blanca Road on 347, going southbound? Is it 65? | |
Joined: Jul 2005 | |
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| | Jason
Posts:3378
| | 11/18/2007 1:00 AM |
Alert | Posted By geewiz on 11/17/2007 4:57 PM
Since the law trumps the law breakers ( speeders) I will travel in the left lane at 65 as long as I wish.
What part of "drive in the right most lane available" do you not understand? | |
Joined: Jul 2005 | |
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| | Sp.ed.Tchr
Posts:142
| | 11/18/2007 1:10 AM |
Alert | I really HATE that I am contributing to this conversation, but here goes:
From Wikipedia "Passing Lane":
Common Practice and most law on United States Highways is that the left lane is reserved for passing and faster moving traffic, and that traffic using the left lane must yield to traffic wishing to overtake. The United States Uniform Vehicle Code states:
Upon all roadways any vehicle proceeding at less than the normal speed of traffic at the time and place and under the conditions then existing shall be driven in the right-hand lane then available for traffic ...
The Massachusetts Institute of Technology's website on "Keep Right Laws" points out that:
This law refers to the "normal" speed of traffic, not the "legal" speed of traffic. The 60 MPH driver in a 55 MPH zone where everybody else is going 65 MPH must move right..."Ώ]
It is also illegal in many states in the U.S. to use the "far left" or passing lane on a major highway as a travelling lane (as opposed to passing), or to fail to yield to faster moving traffic that is attempting to overtake in that lane. For example, Colorado's "Left Lane Law" states:
A person shall not drive a motor vehicle in the passing lane of a highway if the speed-limit is sixty-five miles per hour or more unless such person is passing other motor-vehicles that are in a non-passing lane...(emphasis added)ΐ]
Other examples, such as Massachusetts (General Statute 89-4B), New Jersey, Maine, Illinois, Pennsylvania, and others, make it illegal to fail to yield to traffic that seeks to overtake in the left lane, or to create any other "obstruction" in the passing lane that hinders the flow of traffic. As a result, heavy trucks are often prohibited from using the passing lane.
A common problem arising from misuse of the "fast lane" is that it forces faster moving traffic that wishes to overtake on the left to change lanes, do so on the right, and then change lanes again. Further, if the vehicle misusing the passing lane is going slower than the flow of other traffic, it forces those using the middle "travel" lane (but who are moving faster) to pass on the right as well, even though they have no intention of doing so.
A driver hoping to pass a slow motorist in the "fast lane" is stuck in an awkward situation. One strategy is to signal a lane change toward the center median. Another is to flash headlights. A third, which sacrifices safety, is to drive very close to the "fast lane" driver's bumper (this is known as tailgating). In Germany it is common to signal a lane change toward the center of the road, as if there where another lane to the left of the "fast lane".
Most commonly, motorists will attempt to overtake the outer car on the inner lane either to continue at a face pace or to pass a car that is simply going too slow in the passing lane. For high-capacity multilane freeways (three or more lanes per direction), many motorists often pass on the inner lane, largely in response to misuse of the "passing lane" by slower traffic. | | | |
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| | Sp.ed.Tchr
Posts:142
| | 11/18/2007 1:14 AM |
Alert | | Like it or not, according to this website (http://www.mit.edu/~jfc/right.html), Arizona follows the Uniform Vehicle Code and requires drivers to keep right if they are going slower than the normal speed of traffic (regardless of the speed limit). | | | |
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| | Sp.ed.Tchr
Posts:142
| | 11/18/2007 1:18 AM |
Alert | It also says that "vehicles moving at the normal speed of traffic are permitted in the left lane even when they are unnecessarily obstructing other traffic".
Same exact info on this site (http://www.driverightpassleft.com/laws/index.asp) | | | |
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| | missPolitick
Posts:645
| | 11/18/2007 5:33 PM |
Alert | I was pulled over in 1998, the day I moved to Arizona, for driving in the left lane. It was on I-10 between Tucson and Phoenix. There were NO OTHER cars around me and I hadn't heard that rule ( I was 18 ) so I was just cruising along minding my own business. My point is that you should drive in the right lane unless you are passing. No one likes the "enforcer"! (The person who tries to block everyone in and make them drive the speed limit.) Just be normal!
(He didn't ticket me, but wanted me to be aware that I shouldn't be hanging out in the left lane.) | |
Despite All My Rage I Am Still Just A Rat In A Cage | |
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| | geewiz
Posts:482
| | 11/18/2007 7:41 PM |
Alert | | The only way someone is breaking the law by doing the speed limit in the left lane is by other breaking the law and going greater than the legal speed. Thus thier illegal act of speeding is the cause of the act of the person doing the speed limit. I was just over at my nephews house and his wife is a lawyer and she used this is several cases she faught and won all of them. The only time she was not able to win one of these tickets she advised the client not to fight the ticket the driver was cited for doing 58 in a 65. She said by proving their was no intent by going under the posted speed limit and that the speeders were the cause the cases were dismissed. | |
Be strong ARMY STRONG America's backbone. | |
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| | Jason
Posts:3378
| | 11/18/2007 7:54 PM |
Alert | Posted By geewiz on 11/18/2007 7:41 PM
The only way someone is breaking the law by doing the speed limit in the left lane is by other breaking the law and going greater than the legal speed. Thus thier illegal act of speeding is the cause of the act of the person doing the speed limit.
Two wrongs don't make a right. This has got to be the poorest set of reasoning for breaking the law I've ever seen.
28-721. Driving on right side of roadway; exceptions
B. On all roadways, a person driving a vehicle proceeding at less than the normal speed of traffic at the time and place and under the conditions then existing shall drive the vehicle in the right-hand lane then available for traffic or as close as practicable to the right-hand curb or edge of the roadway, except when overtaking and passing another vehicle proceeding in the same direction or when preparing for a left turn at an intersection or into a private road or driveway.
No ifs, ands or buts, if you are going less than the normal flow, you're breaking the law.
Where is your proof your speedometer is calibrated? Do you have tires installed on your car that are of a different size than what originally came with the car? If so that will throw off the speedometer reading.
What does it hurt you to get in the right lane? Really? If anything it will make your drive more pleasant, which is what everyone who advocates going the speed limit lists as a positive. Your position is hypocritical.
I was just over at my nephews house and his wife is a lawyer and she used this is several cases she faught and won all of them.
Judges also let off people who speed, what is your point? | |
Joined: Jul 2005 | |
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| | Jason
Posts:3378
| | 11/18/2007 7:56 PM |
Alert | And once again as a reminder, I will point out that I was pulled over on US 60 for being in the left lane even though there was traffic passing at 10-20+ MPH over the limit. The officer said that I was a danger to the traffic and he did have the power to ticket me.
I guess this is part of why our roads could never be like the Autobahn, too many self-righteous, selfish control freaks that don't realize that what they are doing is unsafe. | |
Joined: Jul 2005 | |
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