Fair
48°F
High: 76°F
Low: 46°F
Currently : Sunny
12 Oct 2008
> Five-day forecast
 Search
   
 
   

Business Directory
Add your Business
Coupons
Add your Coupon
Classifieds
Add Your Classified
Subject: Church Profits 45M Plus / Is that OK?
Prev Next
You are not authorized to post a reply.

Page 5 of 6 << < 123456 > >>
AuthorMessages
CliffinAZUser is Offline

Posts:405

02/22/2008 12:12 AM Alert 
DD, I think that anyone who has been active on this forum knows that you've criticized the city/council on many issues. If you'll recall, I was one of the people vehemently protesting prayer (particularly prayer to a specific religion) during council meetings. But I also can't see anything that the city--or the COH for that matter--has done wrong with this one, or any way that it's not a win-win situation. Give credit where credit is due...
CliffinAZUser is Offline

Posts:405

02/22/2008 12:25 AM Alert 
Posted By TheSmokingGun on 02/21/2008 11:31 PM

Godsey is a Monday Morning QB.  Nothing more, nothing less.   amazing he didn't speak.

Yes, as MaryMan said it's amazing that he would complain about the city going through with it on his website after the fact, when he was at the meeting himself and didn't say anything.  You'd think that he would speak out about something he had an issue with.  The fact that he didn't--and only noted that he had a problem with it after the deal was made--is a pretty damning demonstration of weak leadership behavior from someone aspiring to be the next mayor, to say the least.

golf_rules2User is Offline

Posts:0

02/22/2008 8:42 AM Alert 
Posted By CliffinAZ on 02/22/2008 12:25 AM
Posted By TheSmokingGun on 02/21/2008 11:31 PM

Godsey is a Monday Morning QB.  Nothing more, nothing less.   amazing he didn't speak.

Yes, as MaryMan said it's amazing that he would complain about the city going through with it on his website after the fact, when he was at the meeting himself and didn't say anything.  You'd think that he would speak out about something he had an issue with.  The fact that he didn't--and only noted that he had a problem with it after the deal was made--is a pretty damning demonstration of weak leadership behavior from someone aspiring to be the next mayor, to say the least.



I totally agree!  Godsey's real character appears.  I hope he keeps talking, because the more he talks, the more we REALLY get to know who he is.
godseyUser is Offline

Posts:27

02/22/2008 10:58 AM Alert 
For the record....I am NOT against the expansion of the park. I believe Marty McDonald has done a great job and have told him so. I am NOT against the COH church for their willingness to sell land to the city. For the city to buy land appraised at $80,000 for $70,000 is a good deal. What I have said is I AM against and do not support the manner in which the deal was handled. It was a deal that because of conflict-of-interests with city officials, needed to be handled more appropriately so the appearance of wrong-doing or a "shady" deal was addressed. My opinion is, the city should have waited until the church had closed escrow and then presented their intentions based on the facts.
CliffinAZUser is Offline

Posts:405

02/22/2008 11:08 AM Alert 
Posted By godsey on 02/22/2008 10:58 AM
My opinion is, the city should have waited until the church had closed escrow and then presented their intentions based on the facts.



The issue is that during the council meeting, when you had a clear opportunity to bring this up (something you obviously feel pretty strongly about) before it was a done deal and in a public forum with those who made the decision present, you sat by quietly and said nothing about it, instead waiting until the next day to say negative things about it on your website.  This is playing Monday-morning quarterback after the fact--after choosing not to act during the window of opportunity when your actions might have actually had an impact.

godseyUser is Offline

Posts:27

02/22/2008 11:45 AM Alert 
Cliffinaz
I respect your opinion. But the fact is the decision for this was made a long time ago, the council vote was a formality and the plans for the park and on the deal have been settled for quite a while, nothing anyone could have said would have changed the fact that it was going to happen. My opinion is that something that may have been a great thing is being turned into a conflict because of a lack of information. The city was going to vote for it no matter what anyone said at this last meeting. When was the last time the council reversed their opinions/decisions based on concerns from citizens? Very rare indeed. It is pointless to try to change our current administration minds on issues because they are already made up. Their intentions are obvious to many. And that goes for the good things the council has done and the bad. Community input at these very rarely has swayed them. Maybe once in a while at best.
JoeManUser is Offline

Posts:64

02/22/2008 11:54 AM Alert 

Nice cover attempt, Mr. Godsey. You still had the opportunity to voice your opinion and you didn't.

AND for the record, you did say you were against it. I know you're getting yourself into a big loop of lies here, so for your memory, see your comment posted by you on this article:

http://85239.com/NEWS/NewsArticleDetails.aspx?mid1=430&&ArticleID=3146

 

Here let me help and copy your quote:

"Yes this was a unanimous vote to approve and no, as a Mayoral candidate, I did not support it."

RabbitUser is Offline

Posts:250

02/22/2008 12:08 PM Alert 

Man, not even mayoral candidates realize that arguing on the internet is a bad idea... 


"Sometimes I think you have to march right in and demand your rights, even if you don't know what your rights are, or who the person is you're talking to. Then on the way out, slam the door."
DesertDwellerUser is Offline

Posts:2559


02/22/2008 12:16 PM Alert 

An experienced manager knows that management by committee rarely works. There are times when community input is helpful, but this wasn't one of them. The state legislature wisely excluded negotiations for real property from the open meetings law and did so for a very good reason: putting your cards out on the table before a deal is constructed causes speculation, price fixing, and usually results in a higher price for the municipality.

The role of the City Council is to review and approve or disapprove these deals based upon their individual merit, not to hold elections each time a decision comes before them. Council meetings are open so that citizens can voice their support or concern. Typically, if there is more discussion than appropriate for a single meeting, a schedule for community input is established. In this case, the only opposition was in the form of inappropriate outbursts from Robbie Olson. 

I think the point here is that you had an opportunity to voice your concern in the appropriate forum at at the proper time and you chose not to.  Telling us how you feel about it now accomplishes nothing.

In this case, the Planning Department did their job correctly and effectively. The PRL Director did an outstanding job throughout the process. There was never any nefarious dealing involved, only the unfounded accusations of such.


Stupid should hurt!

Desert Dweller - Senior Member - Posts: 2982 - Joined: Feb 2006
JasonUser is Offline

Posts:3378


02/22/2008 12:33 PM Alert 
Posted By godsey on 02/22/2008 11:45 AM
Cliffinaz
I respect your opinion. But the fact is the decision for this was made a long time ago, the council vote was a formality and the plans for the park and on the deal have been settled for quite a while, nothing anyone could have said would have changed the fact that it was going to happen. My opinion is that something that may have been a great thing is being turned into a conflict because of a lack of information. The city was going to vote for it no matter what anyone said at this last meeting. When was the last time the council reversed their opinions/decisions based on concerns from citizens? Very rare indeed. It is pointless to try to change our current administration minds on issues because they are already made up. Their intentions are obvious to many. And that goes for the good things the council has done and the bad. Community input at these very rarely has swayed them. Maybe once in a while at best.



Even though you feel that their minds were made up, look at what not commenting has done for you. Sometimes, tilting at windmills is a good thing.


Joined: Jul 2005
golf_rules2User is Offline

Posts:0

02/22/2008 1:10 PM Alert 
Posted By godsey on 02/22/2008 12:19 PM
My memory is quite fine. I was not opposed to the deal itself but I was and still am opposed to the vote that took place and the manner in which the deal developed. I cannot explain it any simpler to those few people blasting me without purchasing "Hooked on Phonics" books for them. Im sorry for your misunderstanding of things.

Nice comment for your constituents!

Since you mentioned 'those few people blasting you', let me ask, does a few people blasting you on this forum qualify as a public outcry? I ask because that's the same thing we saw regarding the park land deal, 'those few people blasting' on this forum. I haven't seen any other evidence of a public outcry.

Since you used the term 'public outcry' and we didn't see any at the city council meeting, I'd like to better understand your definition of a public outcry.

golf_rules2User is Offline

Posts:0

02/22/2008 1:13 PM Alert 
Posted By MaryMan on 02/21/2008 6:32 PM
Azcarcarrier was there also! Where was your comment card? Why didn't you speak out?

I'm sure you have a nice reason for not speaking out publically, yet condeming people behind your screenname.



Still haven't heard from the man who started this thread.  Azcarcarrier, what's your excuse for not speaking out publically when given the opportunity?

You had plenty of time to prepare your message.  It's not like this was a last minute addition to the council agenda like you've always complained about in the past.

IrishCreamUser is Offline

Posts:277


02/22/2008 1:24 PM Alert 

I have not spoken on this topic at all, the reason is simply that I have nothing to say, period! I don't know how I feel about the situation and am waiting for the final details to be publicly stated somewhere, by the City, the Church or Whoever else has valid information as opposed to inuendos, half-truths and gossip.

Having said that, Mr. Godsey, whether the council had already made their minds up or not, you had a duty, better yet, obligation to the citizens to stand by your word and be a voice for us. Even if the deal was done months ago, you still had an opportunity for your opinions, feelings and thoughts on the situation to be put on record, period! You did not seize that moment because, as you say, " the fact is the decision for this was made a long time ago, the council vote was a formality". Well then, your opinion being stated publicly on behalf of the community's "out cry" should have been a formality as well. At the very least, it would be on record and would stand as something binding and legal for you to run your campaign on, no?!

When someone is running for a publicly elected office they should seize every single opportunity to make their positions known. In fact, you should go out of your way to find ways to make opportunities to put your positions out there. Based on this incident and your following comments, I will not be voting for you sir. I want a leader who will STAND UP and SPEAK when necessary!

Carpe Diem, Godsey, Carpe Diem.


“A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds.”


— Ralph Waldo Emerson
golf_rules2User is Offline

Posts:0

02/22/2008 1:43 PM Alert 
I totally agree, IrishCream!

Also, Mr. Godsey, you did not make your post on your website to make a statement about mistrust created by the current council. Otherwise, you would not have mentioned Mr. Smith since he is not part of the current council.

You made your statement for the sole purpose of creating potential political gain. You are basically insinuating that Mr. Smith is lying about having no involvement in the negotiations with the city on this land purchase, by asking for a sworn statement. That's what's wrong about you. So far, the person who looks guilty is you.

You were asked by Maryman, if you are partners with Robbie Olson. That's a good question. You were also asked if you would be willing to take a lie detector test proving that you are not. You haven't answered yet.
IrishCreamUser is Offline

Posts:277


02/22/2008 2:06 PM Alert 
I just made a bowl of popcorn lol!

“A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds.”


— Ralph Waldo Emerson
azcarcarrierUser is Offline

Posts:306

02/22/2008 9:18 PM Alert 

Please advise me when the COH group produces an appraisal , thus validating the sale price, and the actual amount of land purchased by the city? Is the said property 10 acres or less?  Is the city paying for easments and public right away already establishments?

People have asked why I did not speak, I filled out a card, but was never called to the podium, I guess the Robbie and Will show preempted me.   Oh well I still gained some knowledge of the unusual practices of the City and Council. Just have the powers to be answer the above questions and I think this giant puzzle that is missing quite a few pieces will become clearer soon.

DesertDwellerUser is Offline

Posts:2559


02/22/2008 10:47 PM Alert 
Robbie made an arse of himself. No, I take that back. He already was one before he began his rant. I sure as hell don't hold a membership in the Will Dunn fan club, but Robbie's comments to Will were totally inappropriate. If I didn't think this clown Olson was whacko before the meeting, I would certainly think he was after.

Stupid should hurt!

Desert Dweller - Senior Member - Posts: 2982 - Joined: Feb 2006
azcarcarrierUser is Offline

Posts:306

02/23/2008 11:00 AM Alert 

Bear Down:  Did Robie Olson clear up the question you asked me . 

azcarcarrierUser is Offline

Posts:306

02/23/2008 2:12 PM Alert 

Golf Rules I hope you read my response to the Forum for why I didn't speak.

I would appreciate an opportunity yet to ask and "receive" some sort of logical answer from parties involved in this fiasco.  I felt Rusty Ackers should of spoke to the council and concerned parties up front and truthful.  But once Robie and Will got going it sure got seconded and adjorned quickley.  I felt that the staff and council should answered his question about the premium since they have represented it as a joint project.  I now see the joint requirements on the two parties, church walks away a happy camper, money in their pocket and a 10.00 a year parking lot, that who knows what capital costs the city will encure for this obligation agreed too.   Buying a NOTHING DOWN REAL ESTATE VIDEO and getting the city to fund 2/3rd's plus sure looks questionable.  I buy a piece of Land, take title accordingly, and then sit down and make a marketing move as too what to do with it.  But not have ownership and going after the city for funds prior to closing is crazy.  Rusty can rest assured that I will have someone at the recorders office next friday afternoon just waiting to confirm the deal.  I sure hope the city is not on the hook for origination fees, appraisal cost, etc.  Oh that's right the city purchases real estate without appraisals.  I think the Peed property is sitting at a negative value based off of original purchase price.  -35%

golf_rules2User is Offline

Posts:0

02/23/2008 3:52 PM Alert 

Yes, I read it and I think that your answer is the biggest piece of cow crap I've smelled in Maricopa for a while. Someone as passionately against this purchase would have spoke up and demanded a RIGHTto speak. Someone as aggressive as you would not have let that happen.

I know you own lots and lots of land and I believe you have your own personal agenda and are far from an innocent victim (not resident since you don't live in the city).

For a man who has done so many land deals, I find it very difficult to understand why you insist on calling the difference between what the church paid and what the city paid a premium. In fact I'll call it questionable why you use that term. And interestingly, Olson use the same term.

If El Dorado Holdings sold the land, under value to the church, and the church sells it to the city, under value but slightly higher, I'd call that good stewardship of their assets. Any entity that owns land should be able to sell it for what it's worth. Even if it is a church. Who would begrudge a church the ability to do that? That doesn't make sense.

Even if the church sold it at full value (which they didn't) and made more money, what exactly is wrong with that?

You have other motives for what you say and do and anyone who thinks you don't is a fool.

You stand to make a lot of money off the land you own. Anyone who doesn't know that about you probably ought to realize that. It certainly explains some things.

You are not authorized to post a reply.
Page 5 of 6 << < 123456 > >>

Forums > General Discussion > Politics > Church Profits 45M Plus / Is that OK?



ActiveForums 3.6