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Subject: Are there any restrictions on pit bulls here?
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edforallUser is Offline

Posts:18

05/14/2008 6:02 PM Alert 
OMG dude! That is insane! I'm so glad you and your son are ok. Kinda reminds me of the movie Kujo...How did you get it out of your house?


I put my son in the car, closed the garage door and went around back and opened the back door. I ran around to the front and whistled really loud. When I heard it coming, I went in the side door of the garage and it went out the gate.
edforallUser is Offline

Posts:18

05/14/2008 6:07 PM Alert 

OMG dude! That is insane! I'm so glad you and your son are ok. Kinda reminds me of the movie Kujo...How did you get it out of your house?

 

I put my son in his car seart, closed the garage door, went arounbd the back of the house to see if I could see the dog. I opened the back door. ran to the front whstled loudly and as it ran out of the house to the side gate I ran into the side door of the garage.

edforallUser is Offline

Posts:18

05/14/2008 6:08 PM Alert 

Sorry- new at this didn't mean to reply twice.

JasonUser is Offline

Posts:3378


05/14/2008 6:40 PM Alert 
Posted By Michelle on 05/14/2008 1:17 PM

Third, statistics like "pit bulls are responsible for most of the deaths [resulting from] dog bites" fail to take into account several factors, including

 

You should take it up with the CDC then.

1) the relative population of the breed (if Pit Bulls are more prevalent in a population than Dalmations, then there are likely to be more recorded incidences of aggression by Pit Bulls than Dalmations, regardless of which breed is more "inherently" aggressive);

 

Are there seriously more pit bulls than other breeds?

2) media bias, related to the controversial nature of so-called "bully breeds" (even supposedly scientific studies are really just surveys of media reports rather than consistently maintained records, which tend not to exist anyway -- case in point, the CDC stopped tracking which dogs were involved in fatal attacks after 1998, as they were "no longer conisdered to be of discernable value" for all of these reasons!); and

What bias? I posted an article published by the CDC, not the media. Secondly, do you really believe there would be a sudden change in the last ten years?

3) owner bias, insofar that less responsible owners or owners who want to foster aggression in their dogs may be drawn to different breeds.

 

Ah but wait, you said that the breed is not trained for attacking humans. So owner bias shouldn't play a role here.


Joined: Jul 2005
maricopacabanaUser is Offline

Posts:343


05/15/2008 6:48 AM Alert 
Posted By Jason on 05/14/2008 6:40 PM
Posted By Michelle on 05/14/2008 1:17 PM

What bias? I posted an article published by the CDC, not the media. Secondly, do you really believe there would be a sudden change in the last ten years?

3) owner bias, insofar that less responsible owners or owners who want to foster aggression in their dogs may be drawn to different breeds.

 

Ah but wait, you said that the breed is not trained for attacking humans. So owner bias shouldn't play a role here.


The CDC report is really poor science.  As stated there are 3 registered types of Pit Bull.  This report refers to Pit Bull type dogs.  How were the breeds determined?  By news accounts and Humane Society ID.  The Humane Society does a great job at trying to place dogs.  But have you ever gone to one and see what breeds they claim some mutts are?  They really aren't experts on breeds or breeding.  So a pit bull type dog could mean the 3 registered breeds, several similar looking breeds and a myriad of Mutt combos.  So do we have evidence of how many of these dogs were papered Breeds?  No.  So how do we ban such a nebulous breed designation?  Instead we should regulate based on behaviour. 

 

Now reread her previous post.  She said they were originally not bred to be human aggressive.  They were bred to be aggressive to dogs not people.  Dogs that showed human aggression were put down because handlers didn't want to be attacked.  Skip forward to today where some owners get them and try to harness there skills towards people, in this case owner bias is a valid claim.

MichelleUser is Offline

Posts:102


05/15/2008 2:24 PM Alert 
The CDC report wasn't a scientific survey. It was a literature review of two sources: Humane Society records and news articles (i.e. media reports) about fatal dog attacks.

Did you even read the report before quoting it, Jason? From the report's abstract:

Conclusions - Although fatal attacks on humans appear to be breed-specific (pit bull-type dogs and Rottweilers), other breeds may bite and cause fatalities at higher rates. Because of difficulties inherent in determining a dog's breed with certainty, enforcement of breed specific ordinances raises constitutional and practical issues ....


This is exactly why the catch phrase for people opposed to breed specific legislation is "punish the deed; not the breed."

Another statistic that might interest you:

- According to the American Canine Temperament Testing Association, 82.5%of the American Pit Bull Terriers that took the temperament test passed, compared to a 77% passing rate for all breeds on average. In the test a dog is placed in a series of confrontational situations. The first sign of aggression or panic is a failure of the test. Pit Bulls have achieved the fourth highest passing rate of all 122 breeds tested.

I used to be Chelle.

"Well-behaved women seldom make history." - Laurel Thatcher Ulrich
JasonUser is Offline

Posts:3378


05/15/2008 3:42 PM Alert 
Did you even read the report before quoting it, Jason?


Oh please, let's not get into who read what, OK? Because I never claimed that Pit Bulls should be banned or anything along those lines. I just quoted a report that showed that as a breed they are responsible for the most deaths in response to those saying it isn't the breed's fault. There has been conflicting information (from you included) as to whether or not it's the owner or the breed. That's all I'm seeking to clarify. I'm not condemning the breed.

Joined: Jul 2005
MichelleUser is Offline

Posts:102


05/15/2008 5:43 PM Alert 
The three Pit Bull type breeds were originally bred to be dog aggressive, not human aggressive. As I stated and MaricopaCabana reiterated, "Pit Bulls" were bred to be docile with humans because their handlers often had to come between them in dog fights.

Some irresponsible, modern-day owners, drawn to the breed's reputation as aggressive, have trained them to be so. This isn't so much a contradiction as it is a self-fulfilling prophecy.


I used to be Chelle.

"Well-behaved women seldom make history." - Laurel Thatcher Ulrich
MommystaceyUser is Offline

Posts:184

05/15/2008 9:03 PM Alert 
Lets face it if the little Chihuahuas where bigger and had teeth we would be in seriuos trouble. Pits have a bad wrap because of there muscle tone and the ability to bit harder. Other dogs are way more aggressive!
maricopacabanaUser is Offline

Posts:343


05/16/2008 6:17 AM Alert 

Posted By Jason on 05/15/2008 3:42 PM

Did you even read the report before quoting it, Jason?


 I just quoted a report that showed that as a breed they are responsible for the most deaths in response to those saying it isn't the breed's fault.

 

The point is this report that everyone likes to wave around did not specify what breed causes the deaths.  They just say "pitbull type dog". 

PizzakingUser is Offline

Posts:230


05/16/2008 5:28 PM Alert 
This thread is never gonna go anywhere. Weve tried this discussion in the past about 5 times or so. Its always one group saying hte Pit is dangerous and giving stats and news reports about fatalaties.

Then the other group says Bassett hounds are jsut as dangerous and can shred a person as well and that Pits are actually the sweetest little thing in the world. That they get a bad rap and none of the storys are true. Then someone always has to throw out the "can you spot a Pit" link and think thats justification. Bet if ya went to any forum discussing this its there. Its their most common defense.

They wont and will never listen. Move to the next subject plz.


Pizzaking
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