fuego
Posts:54
 | | 09/19/2007 7:24 AM |
 Alert | I was not able to attend last nights meeting. Does anyone have status on this agenda item:
8.17 **Airport Feasibility Study. The City Council shall discuss and possibly take action on approving the Airport Feasibility Study and approval to proceed with Phase II – Airport Site Selection. Discussion and Action.
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fuego
Posts:54
| | 09/19/2007 1:05 PM |
Alert | | Yeah amazing how short sighted and uninformed the Council continues to be even after overwhelming public response that they need to focus on more immediate concerns. Just how do they think they are going to finance each of these larks? It's been stated many times that with economic slowdown that they're projections were way off the market and need to be dramatically lowered and the fact that they have squandered so much money on consultants that have yet to yield any proven results, ie no economic development in sight - where do they think they're going to able to find the funds? | | | |
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Chuck
Posts:61
| | 09/19/2007 1:12 PM |
Alert | | Sounds to me like someone has been having a hard time selling their farm/ranch. | | | |
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YZRacer
Posts:1634
| | 09/19/2007 1:20 PM |
Alert | Posted By JillyBean on 09/19/2007 11:43 AM
God this makes my stomach turn.. WE DONT NEED A EFFING AIRPORT.
I second that motion!
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If you can't spot the loser, it might be you
Senior Member
Posts: 665
Joined: Jun 2006 | |
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MommaToni
Posts:1045
| | 09/19/2007 1:45 PM |
Alert | | so is this like a major airport or just some tiny little thing... what's the point when Sky Harbor is only 1/2 hour away...? | |
Ppppppbbbbbbssssssssssttttttttt! | |
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Fritzydoodle
Posts:1011
| | 09/19/2007 1:48 PM |
Alert | | The city has delusions of the next Scottsdale or Deer Valley Airpark. In reality, more money the city does NOT have will be spent chasing the rainbow. | |
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fuego
Posts:54
| | 09/19/2007 3:00 PM |
Alert | | Chasing just one rainbow would be nice. | | | |
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maricopacabana
Posts:344
| | 09/19/2007 7:44 PM |
Alert | | This frustrating. We have several new codes sitting in legal for over a year because they are understaffed, yet we drop a wad of cash to determine if we need an airpark that there is no demand for. I am waiting for an annoucement stating we are hiring a consultant to determine if Maricopa needs a Navy. | | | |
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Cactus Rob
Posts:1120
| | 09/19/2007 8:01 PM |
Alert | | Be careful, Cabana .... You're giving them ideas! | | | |
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DesertDweller
Posts:2562
| | 09/19/2007 10:20 PM |
Alert | | The Maricopa Navy? I have experience! | |
Stupid should hurt!
Desert Dweller - Senior Member - Posts: 2982 - Joined: Feb 2006 | |
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Tigg
Posts:549
| | 09/20/2007 5:47 AM |
Alert | And of course once we have a consultant who determines we need a Navy (because of course that means that the consultant will determine that we need a Navy because it will guarentee that the consultant gets paid for Phase 2 - where to house this Navy - they'll then want to build an ocean for this Navy to train. So well have an airport, a Navy and an ocean, but we still won't have even a location for a city hall let alone an actual real permanent city hall complex.
Sure, an airport would be nice, but . . . it only takes about 2 functioning brain cells to determine where the priorities should be. I think they need to spend a day back in Kindergarten - to learn the difference between "needs" and "wants". I'm sure the 5 year olds could explain how this works, maybe even in terms these guys could understand since they don't seem to understand adult words! (Side note: Even my DOG understands the difference between needs and wants!) | | | |
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chessman
Posts:250
| | 09/20/2007 6:01 AM |
Alert | And this fixation on the airport idea is one of the driving factors behind the relentless pursuit of the annexation. Kill one and we cripple the other.
I read an article printed in the San Tan Monthly about the Maricopa Airport plans. For the first time I saw it printed that the city wants to take the Estrella Sailport. I also had to wonder about the lack of a reality check. They are planning on attracting general aviation away from the valley because there aren't enough hangars and tie-downs. If that were a reality I would expect Casa Grande Muni would see the in-rush first. Casa Grande is well established, and is very easy to access from the greater Phoenix area. While I agree that eventually plane owners will move their machines this way, it certainly isn't showing any signs of happening any time soon. | |
This message was composed entirely of 100% recycled electrons; minimum 35% post-consumer content. | |
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akflyer
Posts:58
| | 09/20/2007 9:34 AM |
Alert | | There is a need for hangers. Casa Grande has a waiting list for hangers that is years long. Some of the airports like Chandler are more along the lines of 12-14 years. They are building them at Falcon Field in Mesa and supposedly at Casa Grande, but that will come nowhere close to filling the need. | | | |
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alanf
Posts:1582
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Dan Rather
Posts:53
| | 09/20/2007 9:49 AM |
Alert | Posted By akflyer on 09/20/2007 9:34 AM
There is a need for hangers. Casa Grande has a waiting list for hangers that is years long. Some of the airports like Chandler are more along the lines of 12-14 years. They are building them at Falcon Field in Mesa and supposedly at Casa Grande, but that will come nowhere close to filling the need.
Thank you for filling us in on the whole story. | |
Goodnight, weaklings. | |
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chessman
Posts:250
| | 09/20/2007 10:19 AM |
Alert | | Yep there are waiting lists. But, if it were profitable to build more hangars, then you would see a rush on to build more hangars at any municipal airport with the space to do so. That just isn't happening. Some of that is the slow process of getting a city government to approve and fund such a project, but use the market as exists in other areas as a gauge for this one. Yes, people want hangars, but there are still plenty of tie-downs available while people wait to upgrade their parking at the airport of their choice - usually the one closest to home. | |
This message was composed entirely of 100% recycled electrons; minimum 35% post-consumer content. | |
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Dan Rather
Posts:53
| | 09/20/2007 10:25 AM |
Alert | | I think I trust the city a little bit more than you guys, on this one. | |
Goodnight, weaklings. | |
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Fritzydoodle
Posts:1011
| | 09/20/2007 10:27 AM |
Alert | Posted By Dan Rather on 09/20/2007 9:49 AM Posted By akflyer on 09/20/2007 9:34 AM
There is a need for hangers. Casa Grande has a waiting list for hangers that is years long. Some of the airports like Chandler are more along the lines of 12-14 years. They are building them at Falcon Field in Mesa and supposedly at Casa Grande, but that will come nowhere close to filling the need. Thank you for filling us in on the whole story.
Cost to develop an airport: $50+million
Cost to rent a hanger per month: $205
Do the math. You can't put enough hangers, shades, tie-downs etc on the property to cover the cost to build the infrastructure let alone maintain it. Casa Grande has a waiting list. Casa Grande has had a municipal airport for 50 years. Not to mention a town that has significant infrastructure in place. AND not to mention Casa Grande only within the last year or sold leased the last industrial property in phase one of the airport development. It doesn't happen overnight. It takes years and money to develop a successful airpark.
Maricopa needs significant additions to the basic city infrastructure - such as City Hall, Parks & Rec Buildings, police/fire substations and on and on, before it should consider a cash cow like an airport.
What did the study show - some 50 odd aircraft registered to addresses in Maricopa. 50 aircraft at $200 a month won't support an airport. Why should the rest of the residents support a facility they won't use. | |
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bear down
Posts:62
| | 09/20/2007 11:35 AM |
Alert | In agreement with Fritz and Fuego. Too much flip-flopping:
1. City Center - centralized, then - decentralized, then - downtown, then - shelved with no explanation to the taxpayers of what they status currently is.
2. Annexation - huge push by most if not all of the Council Members without a feasability study, now - no longer a priority.
3. Airport - lost out on purchase of Phx Regional already located in Maricopa but still made the decision to hire a consultant paying astronomical sums (2-3yrs worth of salary) before even having a feasability study done (which just recently came out with some anemic data and obscure future projected revenues but without any hard and fast numbers of the costs of maintaining the airport yet they still decided to move forward with 3 airports, Chandler, CG & even Maricopa within a 25-mile radius.
4. Economic Development - To date many dollars and years spent to lure ED with no measurable success.
These are arguably worthy pursuits. I do commend the Council for considering them. But, it doesn't seem like anyone has taken the time to put a pencil to paper to estimate actual costs, short-term and long-term, to determine cost feasabillity vs. benefits if see if they're even attainable. It's very similar to the lottery syndrome where the winners have never seen so much money in their lifetimes and think it's never-ending with most eventually bankrupting themselves.
Council, narrow your list to what is best for city in the here and now. Leave the other dreams and aspirations for future Councils to consider when their time has come. Economic Development & Transportation would be great to start with and a City Hall would be beneficial too. By narrowing and taking smaller bites, you can do it and do it well. Take a bite, get behind it with huge effort and see it through. If you can't make unbiased opinion or vote on an issue if it will detract or enhance the value of your holdings, put it in your citizens hands. Get the collective voice to help you. Don't base current decisions on potential future occurences that may or may not come into fruition.
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Dan Rather
Posts:53
| | 09/20/2007 3:19 PM |
Alert | | So you guys know more than the government? Right. | |
Goodnight, weaklings. | |
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