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| | Author | Messages | |
Hudson
Posts:91
 | | 05/15/2008 1:23 PM |
 Alert | Alright, I will be the first to admit I generally avoid political discussions... but this one is more religious than anything else. A little background on me personally: I do not watch TV. I own a TV but it is rarely on and I have no cable so I pay zero attention to political ads and pundits. So if this issue has been hyped, I must have missed it. The idea first popped into my head this morning - out of nowhere - and then I thought surely I must be crazy. But I came to work and casually mentioned it to another person in my office and they said "you know what, I had that SAME thought last night!" So I began to wonder... The thought was about Barack Obama. I was listening to the radio - not even talk radio, just a regular morning show - and someone mentioned his name. Immediately my mind flashed back to the Left Behind series, the rapture and the antichrist. And I couldn't help but associate, in my mind, the idea of the antichrist with this incredibly charismatic person who has literally come from out of nowhere and, despite his brief record in politics and all the questions about who he really is and what he really believes, could quite possibly soon be the president of this country. So I did a quick google search... and here is the very first link that came up:
http://www.barackobamaantichrist.blogspot.com/ But it doesn't stop there. There are literally pages and pages all dedicated to this same theory... Now I know I am going to get crucified for even stating this and asking the question, but clearly I'm not the first person to have ever had this thought. I'm also not saying it's true, I'm asking: What do you think? | |
Repeat after me...
My parents are NOT to blame. I am NOT a Victim. The consequences of my actions are MY RESPONSIBILITY. | |
| | hastings1066
Posts:1011
| | 05/15/2008 3:56 PM |
Alert | Interesting idea. The parallels are intriguing, but remember, the books are fiction. It's just an example of life imitating art. I do not agree with Obama's very liberal positions but I doubt that he is the ant-Christ I may change my mind if he gets elected and wants to stamp a bar code on our foreheads. 
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| | ChimneyDuck
Posts:293
| | 05/15/2008 4:05 PM |
Alert | This is a joke, right?
If not, perhaps you should open your bible and read about the antichrist from a direct source and not rely on recent Fiction to tell you what the antichrist is, what he will claim to be, and what he will do. Then you can ask yourself. "Does Obama match the description and can he in any way do the things described?"
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http://www.maricopabikeclub.com - Join us for a bicycle ride. | |
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| | Bionicbunny
Posts:644
| | 05/15/2008 4:22 PM |
Alert | You are not alone Hudson, I have thought the same thing. | | | |
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| | Hudson
Posts:91
| | 05/15/2008 4:39 PM |
Alert | I do realize the series was fiction, but it was based on the bible. I am not saying the books are a reason to believe one way or the other, I said that was what my mind related to because I am in no way a scripture scholar.
But again, I'm not alone, clearly, in this thought... I didn't come to this conclusion after research and I didn't even say I believed it. But the thought really caught me off guard and made me think... apparently it's done that to others as well. I think THAT in and off itself is the most interesting thing. | |
Repeat after me...
My parents are NOT to blame. I am NOT a Victim. The consequences of my actions are MY RESPONSIBILITY. | |
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| | ChimneyDuck
Posts:293
| | 05/15/2008 4:52 PM |
Alert | People have been calling political opponents the anti-christ for almost 2000 years.
The most amusing in my mind is Martin Luther calling the papacy the anti-christ and the Pope calling Martin Luther the anti-christ.
But listen to Rev Falwell. Obama can't be the anti-christ. He's not a jew.
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http://www.maricopabikeclub.com - Join us for a bicycle ride. | |
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|  | Hudson
Posts:91
| | 05/15/2008 4:58 PM |
Alert | Okay, does the bible say the antichrist will be a Jew? I have not read the bible... and don't really have one handy.  | |
Repeat after me...
My parents are NOT to blame. I am NOT a Victim. The consequences of my actions are MY RESPONSIBILITY. | |
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| | Hudson
Posts:91
| | 05/15/2008 5:00 PM |
Alert | By the way, I'm just sayin now that I will be out of town all weekend so if I don't respond after tomorrow morning - it's not because you chased me off or something... just off playing.  I am really eager to hear what others have to say on this issue. No bashing please. Just discussing ideas. | |
Repeat after me...
My parents are NOT to blame. I am NOT a Victim. The consequences of my actions are MY RESPONSIBILITY. | |
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| | hastings1066
Posts:1011
| | 05/15/2008 5:21 PM |
Alert | Rather than chastising someone who asked a question about something that she admits she knows little about, it would be more interesting and informative if those who had a deeper understanding of the Bible would discuss the issue and educate those of us with less knowledge. I, for one, would sure like to know more on the subject. | | | |
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| | DaybyDay
Posts:316
| | 05/15/2008 7:21 PM |
Alert | The Bible doesn't say Antichrist is a Jew. But I am sure he doesn't come out of North America. I don't even think the Left Behind series stipulates that. Try reading books by Joel Rosenburg. He is a Christian and is well versed in this subject. In fact, his books were written well before 9-1-1, the death of Yassar Arafat and some other things that have happened in recent history. He is credible and he knows a lot about this subject. He has a series of books, much more intriguing that Left Behind that deal with these issues, as well as Iran, Russia, Middle East. The first book in his series is called The Last Jihad. | | | |
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| | ChimneyDuck
Posts:293
| | 05/15/2008 7:44 PM |
Alert | No, the bible doesn't say the anti-christ has to be a Jew. That was Rev. Falwell. (And since I'm an atheist, I think he's a nut.)
http://www.blueletterbible.org is a good online bible with search, multiple translation and commentaries.
Antichrist appears directly a couple times in the bible. 1 John, 2 John.
Then you have to infer that various other things in the bible refer to the antichrist. The entry in wikipedia (which I know shouldn't be used as a reference without checking other sources) mentions "man of sin" mentioned by Paul in 2 Thessalonians chapter 2. And whatever evil beast you want in Revelations. Since revelations is a jumbled mess, you can pretty much make it say anything you want, kind of like a Nostrodamus quatrain, I'd ignore that.
The direct references in John basically state that an antichrist is one that is against Christ. The "The Anti-Christ" is the one that teaches against the divinity of Jesus. Obama is a professed Christian. He just doesn't fit the bill. Now on the other hand, I deny Jesus' divinity. I am an anti-christ, but however, I don't teach against christ, so I probably don't fit the "The Anti-Christ" bill either, but I'm closer to that than Obama is. | |
http://www.maricopabikeclub.com - Join us for a bicycle ride. | |
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| | Hudson
Posts:91
| | 05/15/2008 8:58 PM |
Alert | | Good points. Thank you. But, playing devils advocate here (no pun intended), couldn't he be lying about beleiving in Jesus? Doesn't the bible say something about the antichrist going to into the temple of God and thinking he is better than God? | |
Repeat after me...
My parents are NOT to blame. I am NOT a Victim. The consequences of my actions are MY RESPONSIBILITY. | |
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| | ChimneyDuck
Posts:293
| | 05/15/2008 10:32 PM |
Alert | I think this might be a good reference on the antichrist. New Advent is a catholic encyclopedia. Take that for what you will. . . .
http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/01559a.htm
It seems pretty clear to me, that in every reference, the Antichrist preaches openly against God, not in a closet sort of way.
From that New Advent Encyclopedia link:
The Pauline doctrine is this: "the day of the Lord" will be preceded by "a revolt", and the revelation of the "man of sin." The latter will sit in the temple of God, showing himself as if he were God; he will work signs and lying wonders by the power of Satan; he will seduce those who received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved; but the Lord Jesus shall kill him with the spirit of His mouth, and destroy him with the brightness of His coming
While I'm sure Obama has many faults, I'm not sure I'd describe him as a man of sin, and what temple of God is he going to sit in? He's going to perform miracles powered by Satan? To what end? | |
http://www.maricopabikeclub.com - Join us for a bicycle ride. | |
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| | Hudson
Posts:91
| | 05/16/2008 8:30 AM |
Alert | | I'm just asking the questions... | |
Repeat after me...
My parents are NOT to blame. I am NOT a Victim. The consequences of my actions are MY RESPONSIBILITY. | |
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| | hastings1066
Posts:1011
| | 05/16/2008 10:04 AM |
Alert | Interesting historical side-notes - As the East-West (Catholic-Orthodox) Schism evolved over a period of a 1,000 years, the charge of anti-Christ was exchanged from time to time between Rome and Constantinople. Also, in the late 1300s, when there were rival Popes in Rome and Avignon (The Great Western Schism), supporters of the Popes often called the other Pope the anti-Christ. So, as can be seen, anti-Christ has been a convenient tool used to flagellate opponents for centuries. | | | |
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| | Hudson
Posts:91
| | 05/16/2008 10:09 AM |
Alert | | Interesting. Thanks! | |
Repeat after me...
My parents are NOT to blame. I am NOT a Victim. The consequences of my actions are MY RESPONSIBILITY. | |
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| | EEE
Posts:486
| | 05/16/2008 9:59 PM |
Alert | Snopes says it's false and we all know snopes is the Final Authority! http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/antichrist.asp Of course I am joking about snopes, and I don't agree with everything this article says, but it does have some truths to it. I don't believe Obama is the AntiChrist. Thankfully Christians don't have to worry about the Anti Christ ,as we will be with the Lord. Instead of focusing on the AntiChrist, which will only last for a short period of time, one should be more concerned about the truth of Heaven and Hell and where they will spend eternity.(Like the AntiChrist, this is also addressed in the Bible!) | |
Yeah, it's true- He allowed the fall of man/
But He used it now to exalt the Lamb/
The Lord, who's wise, permits existence of sin/
to be glorified in His forgiveness to men/ | |
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| | JasonY
Posts:3446
| | | Hudson
Posts:91
| | 05/21/2008 3:05 PM |
Alert | I love Snopes! Thanks for all the interesting tidbits!
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Repeat after me...
My parents are NOT to blame. I am NOT a Victim. The consequences of my actions are MY RESPONSIBILITY. | |
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| | Bionicbunny
Posts:644
| | 05/27/2008 3:10 PM |
Alert | Posted By Hudson on 05/15/2008 8:58 PM
Good points. Thank you. But, playing devils advocate here (no pun intended), couldn't he be lying about beleiving in Jesus? Doesn't the bible say something about the antichrist going to into the temple of God and thinking he is better than God?
The devil believes in Jesus. And he knows the bible.
The devil may not let YOU know he believes in Jesus however. I would imagine that satan would tell you whatever lies it takes to turn you away from God either in disbelief or in anger. | | | |
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